What is this world coming to?

[rntracy1]

When I wake up to news like the massacre in Las Vegas, I wonder, what is this world coming to?  My thoughts and prayers go out to the victims, their families, and friends.  The thing that is ALMOST worse than the shooting itself, is that it isn't even shocking anymore, and something as horrific as that SHOULD BE!!!  It is so commonplace now, that it's almost not even newsworthy, let alone shocking, and that is scary!!!  I am not trivializing it in any respect, I am just pointing out how ridiculous it has become when every time you turn on the news there is, yet another, mass shooting, bombing, car driven into a crowd of people, SOMETHING.  Each one getting worse and worse.  Today's shooting is touted as the worst in US History.  Almost like it some contest.  The next person is preparing to beat this record right now as I type this, and that is a scary thought.  We aren't safe anywhere.  We can't let it rule our lives, but it important to be vigilant.  Wherever you are, be aware of your surroundings and ALWAYS know where the exits are.  Stay safe everyone.  Blessed Be.

[jellysundae]

53 minutes ago, rntracy1 said:

The thing that is ALMOST worse than the shooting itself, is that it isn't even shocking anymore, and something as horrific as that SHOULD BE!!!

You're so right...as I read this my reaction isn't shock and horror, it's "not again?!" because this kind of thing is becoming so commonplace now. I too can imagine some people seeing that statement of the worst in US history as a challenge to beat it.

I've never been so pleased to live in a quiet rural area. I know that's no guarantee of no gun-toting madmen etc, but it's got to be statistically safer in quieter areas. I wonder if we'll ever find out what caused this 64 yr. old man to do this...I was expecting it to be a young guy, not a retiree...I'm suspecting something like PTSD or other mental health issues were behind this, a man who didn't get the treatment he needed because of budget cuts and so on. I believe these deaths will be bureaucracy's fault when you get right down to it. :^ /

[ShadowStarEmpress]

The main thing that shocked me was that he had like 10 weapons in his hotel room. How in the world do you hide that many?!

[jellysundae]

12 minutes ago, ShadowStarEmpress said:

The main thing that shocked me was that he had like 10 weapons in his hotel room. How in the world do you hide that many?!

That's a REALLY good point!!! Well, no doubt we'll hear more about the logistics as more news comes out, so we'll get to read theories at least about how he got all those guns into that hotel in the first place.

[kirschteins]

I had a conversation this morning with someone about the "right" to own guns. I don't think there's any reason for people to have any stronger weapons/more ammo than you would use to hunt a deer. I don't like hunting much, but those weapons aren't the kind you can use to kill 60 people in minutes.
But if school shootings and mass killings like these haven't changed people's opinions on gun control in America, I doubt anything will.

[jellysundae]

20 minutes ago, kirschteins said:

I had a conversation this morning with someone about the "right" to own guns. I don't think there's any reason for people to have any stronger weapons/more ammo than you would use to hunt a deer. I don't like hunting much, but those weapons aren't the kind you can use to kill 60 people in minutes.
But if school shootings and mass killings like these haven't changed people's opinions on gun control in America, I doubt anything will.

Yeah, I don't think anything's ever going to alter the entrenched opinions of the people who really want guns. The amount of guns (and gun-related deaths) in the US scares me, way more per capita than in any other country in the western world, even more than those in developing countries that are full of constant war/political unrest/revolution/corruption etc. But the people who are adamant about needing guns won't be swayed by those figures.

[WhiteWolf]

I can't believe that it's gotten to the point where you can't go to a movie, a concert, or even go to a club without taking your life into your hands! You would think you would be safe in a large crowd, but evidently not so much. What's next? Must we be afraid to even get the mail at this point? I hate to say it, but that one is coming, folks. Worse, the person who goes on that rampage will either be a mail carrier or package delivery driver  OR disguised as one.

[midnight_spell360]

14 hours ago, ShadowStarEmpress said:

The main thing that shocked me was that he had like 10 weapons in his hotel room. How in the world do you hide that many?!

EXACTLY! He stayed a couple of days and even if he put on the "Do Not Disturb" sign-after Day 2-shouldn't the hotel manager give the room a thorough once-over to make sure nothing illegal was going on in his /her hotel? Why is it still legal for ppl to buy semi-automatic guns? They are obviously NOT being used for hunting and if we could just have these weapons taken away-that could cut down on a lot of unnecessary violence.

When I first heard about the mass shooting, I was praying really hard for it not to be a "Muslim", and of course, I was praying for all of the victims' families and survivors that had do go through this tragedy, but it is never a "relief" to find out the shooter was "a lone wolf" or "disturbed white male" bc the same 'courtesy' is NEVER given to others.  I am sorry that my panic over "will I be able to get through this day ok?" comes to my mind first, but the Troll in the White House has made it even worse for ppl of my faith to just live in peace. 

[Sinvanor]

I used to live in the US and now live in Europe. I completely agree with everyone on the gun control. What I don't understand is where the limit is. I mean, if your neighbor had a nuclear weapon, then you would want one too. But it's their having it in the first place for "defense" that causes the paranoia as it is anyone who has a gun for "defense". Having weapons causes others to be mistrusting.
The amendment that covers gun rights when it was written did not at all cover what we would have in the future. It meant right to have some kinda arms should things go south, not that anyone can just buy and have guns.

Where I live now, to even get hunting guns for boar and such you have to pass a mental health test and get a type of license.

There are LOTS of things in life I think people can earn the privilege to have, but not a right. Guns are definitely one of them. You should go through a history check and up to date mental health check to have one, and it should be renewed every few years. That would also give more jobs too.

The situation is just sad... I hope that whatever actually happened brings to light the problems that caused this. Mental instability, some history of violence or something, to show that people need help and/or we need to be more scrutinizing to whom can own guns, at least guns that are meant to kill to appease all the gun owners who own hunting rifles.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Sinvanor
New information I didn't know of.

[Sinvanor]

18 hours ago, jellysundae said:

I wonder if we'll ever find out what caused this 64 yr. old man to do this...I was expecting it to be a young guy, not a retiree...I'm suspecting something like PTSD or other mental health issues were behind this, a man who didn't get the treatment he needed because of budget cuts and so on. I believe these deaths will be bureaucracy's fault when you get right down to it. :^ /

Man, that makes it more confusing. I also expected it to be a middle age to younger male as statistically that is what it usually is. 
If there was actual PTSD involved, that just makes this even more sad. I have PTSD (not from war, so the living flash backs thing is not something I encounter) and I know how terrible it can be from just normal abuse, let alone from being in a battle.

My guess sadly is that he may of either had some form of PTSD, in which case he may of been having flash backs or something. Or perhaps considering his age he was really broke, lost his pension or some other financial trouble. That's a really common issue that instigates massacres. Mental instability + financial issues is sadly really common.

[darkangel93]

I've been sitting here for several minutes debating on whether to reply to this post and all its replies or not. I do agree that there should be mental health checks periodically for those who purchase firearms. I also agree that there should be extensive background checks, but I have no problem with people owning guns. I know a lot of people, that I trust, that own firearms. My fiance is one of those people. He has a pistol that he carries almost every day, and I feel like the safest person when I go anywhere with him, and I know that if someone who opens fire on us or anyone else he would easily be able to take the shooter down before lives, or many lives, were lost. I was terrified of guns before he showed me how to properly handle one. Now I'm working on getting my conceal carry permit. 

The Las Vegas shooting was a tragedy, and my thoughts and prayers got out to everyone there. 

[burntpastryies]

2 hours ago, darkangel93 said:

I've been sitting here for several minutes debating on whether to reply to this post and all its replies or not. I do agree that there should be mental health checks periodically for those who purchase firearms. I also agree that there should be extensive background checks, but I have no problem with people owning guns. I know a lot of people, that I trust, that own firearms. My fiance is one of those people. He has a pistol that he carries almost every day, and I feel like the safest person when I go anywhere with him, and I know that if someone who opens fire on us or anyone else he would easily be able to take the shooter down before lives, or many lives, were lost. I was terrified of guns before he showed me how to properly handle one. Now I'm working on getting my conceal carry permit. 

The Las Vegas shooting was a tragedy, and my thoughts and prayers got out to everyone there. 

I completely agree with you. I don't think guns should necessarily be banned, because there are good people out there (like your fiance). Mental health checks would be way beneficial , and who knows, maybe even help stop these tragedies before they even happen.

[rntracy1]

On ‎10‎/‎3‎/‎2017 at 8:44 PM, darkangel93 said:

I've been sitting here for several minutes debating on whether to reply to this post and all its replies or not. I do agree that there should be mental health checks periodically for those who purchase firearms. I also agree that there should be extensive background checks, but I have no problem with people owning guns. I know a lot of people, that I trust, that own firearms. My fiance is one of those people. He has a pistol that he carries almost every day, and I feel like the safest person when I go anywhere with him, and I know that if someone who opens fire on us or anyone else he would easily be able to take the shooter down before lives, or many lives, were lost. I was terrified of guns before he showed me how to properly handle one. Now I'm working on getting my conceal carry permit. 

The Las Vegas shooting was a tragedy, and my thoughts and prayers got out to everyone there. 

First I want to respond by saying that even though this thread is a little bit older, the topic is still very relevant.  Every time we turn on the news, in the USA, there is yet another school shooting, nightclub shooting, police officer shooting, or some type of shooting. 

That being said, I am glad you did decide to respond to the posting because I also agree with you.  Just because these deranged people decide to do stupid things does not mean they should take away our right to bear arms.  Let's try enforcing the gun laws we HAVE before we try making new ones.  People say that the guns used in these shootings were obtained legally.  That the guns used in school shootings were legally owned by the parents.  I also have my CCL (conceal carry license) and a child stealing their parent's guns, breaking into their gun safe, having access to them, or taking them with permission, is NOT a gun that is obtained legally!!!! There is NO WAY, NO HOW, that any child under the age of 18 has gotten any gun legally, to carry out a school shooting.   

On ‎10‎/‎3‎/‎2017 at 3:24 AM, midnight_spell360 said:

EXACTLY! He stayed a couple of days and even if he put on the "Do Not Disturb" sign-after Day 2-shouldn't the hotel manager give the room a thorough once-over to make sure nothing illegal was going on in his /her hotel? Why is it still legal for ppl to buy semi-automatic guns? They are obviously NOT being used for hunting and if we could just have these weapons taken away-that could cut down on a lot of unnecessary violence.

When I first heard about the mass shooting, I was praying really hard for it not to be a "Muslim", and of course, I was praying for all of the victims' families and survivors that had do go through this tragedy, but it is never a "relief" to find out the shooter was "a lone wolf" or "disturbed white male" bc the same 'courtesy' is NEVER given to others.  I am sorry that my panic over "will I be able to get through this day ok?" comes to my mind first, but the Troll in the White House has made it even worse for ppl of my faith to just live in peace. 

I completely agree with you.  Yes, people have the right to privacy, for THE DAY!  But this guy was in this room for 7 days before this happened.  No way should anyone be allowed THAT MUCH privacy. I'm sorry.  Yes, he paid for the room, but just like an apartment, he does not own the room or the building. On the room agreement it should state that they can enter the room for any reason after giving 1 hr notice.  There is no way he move all that stuff within 1 hr.  And if they saw him scurrying around after he was given notice, that would be suspicious too.

Now to touch on the other subject.  I can see why you were praying he wasn't Muslim.  I can't speak for anyone else, but I can tell you, to me, these people aren't Muslim, black, white, Hispanic, or whatever.  They are crazy, disturbed people.  You do have the radical Muslims and the white supremacists, but again, crazy.  I mean, they have to be to allow people to get to them like that in the first place, right?

[jellysundae]

19 minutes ago, rntracy1 said:

I completely agree with you.  Yes, people have the right to privacy, for THE DAY!  But this guy was in this room for 7 days before this happened.  No way should anyone be allowed THAT MUCH privacy.

I don't know the details about this so forgive me if what I now ask is common knowledge in the US. When you say he had the DO NOT DISTURB sign up for that long, does that mean no-one saw him in all that time? I mean, leaving someone alone for that long is gross negligence, surely, they might have been DEAD.

[rntracy1]

8 minutes ago, jellysundae said:

I don't know the details about this so forgive me if what I now ask is common knowledge in the US. When you say he had the DO NOT DISTURB sign up for that long, does that mean no-one saw him in all that time? I mean, leaving someone alone for that long is gross negligence, surely, they might have been DEAD.

We don't know whether he did or not, we were speculating that even IF he did, they shouldn't have allowed it.  I would venture a guess that he did.  I don't think he would have allowed the maid in with all those guns in there.

[jellysundae]

2 minutes ago, rntracy1 said:

We don't know whether he did or not, we were speculating that even IF he did, they shouldn't have allowed it.  I would venture a guess that he did.  I don't think he would have allowed the maid in with all those guns in there.

I suppose the hotel is busy trying to cover their behind if they have been negligent. : / So people are unlikely to ever find out the full truth.

[Nielo]

1 hour ago, rntracy1 said:

Now to touch on the other subject.  I can see why you were praying he wasn't Muslim.  I can't speak for anyone else, but I can tell you, to me, these people aren't Muslim, black, white, Hispanic, or whatever.  They are crazy, disturbed people.  You do have the radical Muslims and the white supremacists, but again, crazy.  I mean, they have to be to allow people to get to them like that in the first place, right?

I agree with this so much! I hate how we've somehow decided in the last few years that "terrorism" is something that (pretty much exclusively) involves extremist Muslims. News media will report things like "authorities (don't) think this was an act of terrorism", depending on the ethnicity of the suspect. Terrorism doesn't have to have a religious motive; any mass shooting/bombing/whatever could be classified as terrorism: these acts are obviously meant to spread fear through violence, which is literally what terrorism means. White people who commit acts like these tend to be described in the media as "disturbed", "loner", "an outcast", which are all things that could probably be said of any radical Muslim attacker as well. I wish we'd just call all of it terrorism, and stop making this distinction; we don't need to create an even bigger schism within our societies.

[phill]

I would disagree with that, given what I see. For example a well known member of parliament publically referring to attacks on mosques as 'terrorist attacks', and then referring to stadium bombings and other attacks as 'incidents'. Other examples I could give but I can't because of a certain press black out. I agree that terrorism is terrorism though, whoever perpetrates it against whom.

[Nielo]

11 minutes ago, phill said:

I would disagree with that, given what I see. For example a well known member of parliament publically referring to attacks on mosques as 'terrorist attacks', and then referring to stadium bombings and other attacks as 'incidents'. Other examples I could give but I can't because of a certain press black out. I agree that terrorism is terrorism though, whoever perpetrates it against whom.

I'm kinda confused on what you're disagreeing with... It sounds like you're agreeing with me?

[phill]

Only on the last sentence, the first bit I'm not agreeing with you. I'm sorry it's a bit vague, I'm trying to stay out of trouble so haven't explained myself very well.

[Nielo]

10 minutes ago, phill said:

Only on the last sentence, the first bit I'm not agreeing with you. I'm sorry it's a bit vague, I'm trying to stay out of trouble so haven't explained myself very well.

Okay, I only just consciously registered the 'press blackout' bit in your previous post, but even after some googling, I have no idea what you're referring to, or how a TDN post could possibly get you into trouble.

But I think we're just disagreeing on the definition of terrorism then? I personally think incidents can be terrorism as well; I don't think it needs to be part of something bigger. Is that what you mean?

[rntracy1]

I agree this can become a heated topic.  Since I speak my mind rather readily (lol) I will try to explain to Nielo, without putting words into your mouth Phill, please let me know if I am explaining this wrong.  I think I get what you are trying to say.

Phill is saying that she does NOT agree with what you said about terrorism ONLY being described as acts perpetrated by radical muslims.   She is saying that certain well known officials have called attacks on mosques "acts of terror", while acts perpetrated by lone white people such as stadium or moving theater bombing/shootings are called "incidents."

Anyway, she agrees with you that ALL acts perpetrated by ALL people should be acts of terrorism regardless of race, creed, sex, or religion. 

It is getting ridiculous seeing all of the school shootings on the news.  It is almost a daily occurrence now.  My husband will say to me, "did you see there was another school shooting?"  While it is horrific, terrible, awful, and beyond words that can describe it, it just is not shocking or surprising.  When you see something like that on the news, you should be in the utmost, total shock!! And it isn't that way anymore.  When you see it every day, you almost become numb to it.  You hear the victims say it, "it's something that happens at other schools, not here."  At other schools!?  Why?  Because it does!! Every single day almost.  They are used to hearing it too.  Something has to change, and it isn't gun laws.  It's the way everyone babies and coddles the kids.  And the parents take the power away from the school and the teachers.  "Not my kid, he wouldn't do that."  "Don't you speak to MY kid like that."  There are two sides to a story.  Your kid is not an angel.  Trust me.  You should see how these kids act in school.  That's why these school shootings happen.  Kids can't handle real life.

[Nielo]

7 minutes ago, rntracy1 said:

I agree this can become a heated topic.  Since I speak my mind rather readily (lol) I will try to explain to Nielo, without putting words into your mouth Phill, please let me know if I am explaining this wrong.  I think I get what you are trying to say.

Phill is saying that she does NOT agree with what you said about terrorism ONLY being described as acts perpetrated by radical muslims.   She is saying that certain well known officials have called attacks on mosques "acts of terror", while acts perpetrated by lone white people such as stadium or moving theater bombing/shootings are called "incidents."

Anyway, she agrees with you that ALL acts perpetrated by ALL people should be acts of terrorism regardless of race, creed, sex, or religion. 

Ah, thanks, in that case, I should've been clearer: I know that occasionally attacks not perpetrated by radical Muslims are called terrorism. Just not often. I was generalising a bit there, because the exceptions are so few and far between these days.

@phill Um... okay? The internet is usually filled with info in case of a press blackout though. Plus I'm sure you and I are in different countries, and I doubt the press blackout would extend that far. I still don't think posting anything on here could hurt you though.

[phill]

It's biased phrasing by members of the gov and selective reporting by the press, but what I'm seeing differs from what you are seeing. You won't know exactly what I am talking about because of that selective reporting and press black out.

 

Phill is saying that she does NOT agree with what you said about terrorism ONLY being described as acts perpetrated by radical muslims.   She is saying that certain well known officials have called attacks on mosques "acts of terror", 

Yes to this.

...while acts perpetrated by lone white people such as stadium or moving theater bombing/shootings are called "incidents."

No, I'm saying that what are clearly terrorist attacks in other cases are being called 'incidents' rather than called what they are... terrorist attacks.

[rntracy1]

1 minute ago, phill said:

It's biased phrasing by members of the gov and selective reporting by the press, but what I'm seeing differs from what you are seeing. You won't be able to  I am talking about because of that selective reporting and press black out.

 

Phill is saying that she does NOT agree with what you said about terrorism ONLY being described as acts perpetrated by radical muslims.   She is saying that certain well known officials have called attacks on mosques "acts of terror", 

Yes to this.

...while acts perpetrated by lone white people such as stadium or moving theater bombing/shootings are called "incidents."

No, I'm saying that what are clearly terrorist attacks in other cases are being called 'incidents' rather than called what they are... terrorist attacks.

Yes, I didn't mean ALL acts perpetrated by lone white people such as stadium bombings are called "incidents."  LOL.  I was just comparing to make the point.  So that Nielo was understanding what you were disagreeing with.  But I think we are all on the same page now.  Whew.  LOL. 

It is hard too when you are trying guess at someone's intonation, facial expressions, etc in a posting. 

I guess too what Nielo was saying, the investigators are always saying, "10 people were gunned down at such and such today.  We are still trying to determine if it was an act of terrorism."  Read between the lines, "we are trying to determine if it was someone from another country/Muslim/whatever" when OF COURSE it was an act of terrorism!  You gun down 10 people, it's terrorism no matter who you are or why you did it.  LOL