Nay for Lousey Genetics!

[Mouseykins]

Posting this in hopes that some of you may have had similar experiences or known someone going through what I'm about to have to deal with.

My 3-year-old, who is turning 4 at the end of next month had a consultation today with the pediatric dentist. She has several cavities already and her two front teeth up top are very bad. After a few weeks of trying to get her seen and looked at, today was our day. We're lucky they had a cancellation and could fit her in, or we'd be waiting until March 16th. I was hoping for better news than I received. In a way, I suspected this may be the outcome but have to face it is a completely different story.

Because her top two central incisors are so bad and infected with hardly any tooth structure left to even hold fillings, she has to get them extracted. She also has cavities on her top lateral incisors (the ones beside the middle ones) and they're under the gum line and the chances of fillings staying in are very slim and may cause further issues for her later on, resulting in another procedure, so he's recommending they be extracted as well. So my baby girl has to get 4 teeth up top pulled! I expected as much for the middle two, but not the ones beside the central incisors. For her molars, because she has cavities on the side and centre of some, he's recommending they be filled and then capped. The concern here is that by drilling into the tooth and filling it, weakens the structure and she may continue to develop cavities. To stop the inevitable domino effect, caps are a fix it and leave it solution until she's older and loses her molars. I'm not sure if it's all her molars that need to be capped. I have to get a copy of the treatment plan from the dentists' office.

To do all this is basically a surgical procedure. She'll be going under general anaesthetic to get everything done all at once. The anesthesiologists are those that work at the children's hospital and the two other major hospitals in the city where her procedure is going to be done. This is comforting to know that I am putting my daughter's life into such qualified hands. These are anesthesiologists that work on newborn babies and small children for major surgery. I'll be allowed into the room with her until she's asleep and then I'll have to wait until she's in recovery and awake to see her. Her surgery will be done at a surgical suite in the city and it's where all the pediatric dentists take their surgical patients.

I've been doing everything right with her teeth and yet here we are. Looking at our family history I'm 95% certain our genetics are just plain lousy. Plus she's a thumb sucker and that doesn't help matters either.

I was so overwhelmed during her appointment that I didn't even think to ask is an orthodontist could do anything for her for the next few years until her adult teeth come in. So I've added that to my list of questions and will be calling on Tuesday since Monday is a holiday.

Our benefits are really good and I'm just crossing my fingers and praying that they'll cover everything for her. For now, I just have to wait for the estimate to be processed and to hear back from my insurance company and go from there.

I've never done anything like this before so I don't even know what questions I should ask. If you have any suggestions, I'm all ears, or eyes rather.

Thankfully these are just her baby teeth! I still feel so bad for her. How am I going to explain to a 4-year-old why she has no teeth and teach her to accept it and not be embarrassed or anything? I sure got my work cut out for me for sure.

Thanks for reading!

~Dawn

[WhiteWolf]

*hugs* Oh, Mousey! I can't begin to imagine what this is like for you. My fiance had several teeth including his front teeth and canines due to really bad sinuses. The roots of the teeth went into the sinus cavity, and made colds painful for him. He had a partial denture made for him. Because they are baby teeth, I don't see your baby girl going down that road.

As for not having teeth in those areas, it's part of growing up until she gets her "big girl" teeth in.

[Mouseykins]

Thanks, @WhiteWolf!

I'm feeling a bit more relaxed about my daughter's unfortunate situation. I know this is what's best for her and her well-being is my top concern. Knowing she'll be in safe non-judgemental hands is helping. I'm starting to look forward to her surgery now. Sure it'll be a big adjustment for her and everyone, but the main thing is she won't be in pain.

I checked my husband's schedule and her surgery is booked for a day he's not working so he can drive and tend to our other 2 girls while A gets my full attention. I've devised a plan and may send them to the mall to the Disney store to get a small plush surprise for Ariel when she's in recovery. Maybe one of those helium balloons and some flowers too. On the plus side, being the middle sister, she'll finally be able to do something before her big sister. She'll be getting a visit from the Tooth Faerie before her big sister! Just have to look on the bright side I guess.

[reousteratt]

Hi! I have been told by my dentist about one genetic factor for increased susceptibility to cavities (of which i am a sufferer) being lower than normal amounts of L-arginine in the saliva. This is a naturally occurring amino acid and some of us unlucky ones may have less of it. Some sensitivity toothpastes have this as an added ingredient. It has the main function of relieving sensitivity by filling the pores in the dentin temporarily, but it's other (unintended) effect is the one that is useful for those of us who are waging a losing war on cavities.  There are a few studies out there if you want the mechanism of how it works, but in short it alters the pH which changes the composition of the biofilm on the teeth to hinder some of the more damaging microorganisms.  I'm not sure if it's appropriate for a 4 year old, but it might be worth a look. Since I've been using it, the decay rate has definitely slowed down.  Anyway, I wish you the best of luck! 

[emily_speck_15]

When I was about 3 I knocked out my front tooth because little me wanted to dance on a table.  I don't really remember doing it, but I know that growing up missing a very noticeable tooth wasn't as big of a deal as one would suspect.  I wish her the best

[Mouseykins]

4 hours ago, reousteratt said:

Hi! I have been told by my dentist about one genetic factor for increased susceptibility to cavities (of which i am a sufferer) being lower than normal amounts of L-arginine in the saliva. This is a naturally occurring amino acid and some of us unlucky ones may have less of it. Some sensitivity toothpastes have this as an added ingredient. It has the main function of relieving sensitivity by filling the pores in the dentin temporarily, but it's other (unintended) effect is the one that is useful for those of us who are waging a losing war on cavities.  There are a few studies out there if you want the mechanism of how it works, but in short it alters the pH which changes the composition of the biofilm on the teeth to hinder some of the more damaging microorganisms.  I'm not sure if it's appropriate for a 4 year old, but it might be worth a look. Since I've been using it, the decay rate has definitely slowed down.  Anyway, I wish you the best of luck! 

I will definitely look into that! Thanks for the info!

23 minutes ago, emily_speck_15 said:

When I was about 3 I knocked out my front tooth because little me wanted to dance on a table.  I don't really remember doing it, but I know that growing up missing a very noticeable tooth wasn't as big of a deal as one would suspect.  I wish her the best

I wouldn't be as worried if it was just 1 tooth, but she's having 4 teeth in a row pulled. Her speech will be altered and it'll be more work for her learning to talk. For a child who loves food and will try anything, she's going to be limited for the next 3-4 years. Plus having to put up with kids teasing if I send her to school. Because of this I may not even bother and might just enrol her in homeschool along with her sister.

[hrtbrk]

Quote

For a child who loves food and will try anything, she's going to be limited for the next 3-4 years. Plus having to put up with kids teasing if I send her to school. Because of this I may not even bother and might just enrol her in homeschool along with her sister.

Stop assuming and thinking the worst, girl!

A will still be able to eat and try all the foods she loves without limitations. She will bite and eat on the side of her mouth instead of the front. She will be fine and will adjust quickly once the extractions heal.

Keeping her from public school because she might get teased is a bit extreme. We have to think rationally instead of emotionally.  A's strong and she won't be the only kiddo in school with missing teeth - either because they fell out naturally, they accidentally got knocked out or because they had them removed just like her. Everyone is different in some way. Kids go to school who are diabetic, have learning disabilities, have allergies etc; they are treated like every other kid.

I love you like my own sister and I understand it is your motherly instinct to protect her at all costs but you cannot keep her sheltered from every day life forever. We can't let our children miss out on life because we impose our own fears or insecurities on them. She's strong. She's a fighter. She's going to be the same ol' feisty go-getter A that she's has grown to be.

Let's just hope that she doesn't find a sudden passion for whistling ;) <3

[Mouseykins]

5 hours ago, hrtbrk said:

Stop assuming and thinking the worst, girl!

A will still be able to eat and try all the foods she loves without limitations. She will bite and eat on the side of her mouth instead of the front. She will be fine and will adjust quickly once the extractions heal.

Keeping her from public school because she might get teased is a bit extreme. We have to think rationally instead of emotionally.  A's strong and she won't be the only kiddo in school with missing teeth - either because they fell out naturally, they accidentally got knocked out or because they had them removed just like her. Everyone is different in some way. Kids go to school who are diabetic, have learning disabilities, have allergies etc; they are treated like every other kid.

I love you like my own sister and I understand it is your motherly instinct to protect her at all costs but you cannot keep her sheltered from every day life forever. We can't let our children miss out on life because we impose our own fears or insecurities on them. She's strong. She's a fighter. She's going to be the same ol' feisty go-getter A that she's has grown to be.

Let's just hope that she doesn't find a sudden passion for whistling ;) <3

You are absolutely right! I have a habit of assuming the worst, it's like my brain's way of preparing for the worst so that my expectations are super low.

Right now she can still eat things that are crunchy and require extra chewing. I've been giving her apples, but instead of cutting them in slices like I normally do, I've been cutting them into small cube-like pieces. It may take a bit but I'm sure she'll learn to bite with just using her bottom teeth and her gum surface up top once it heels.

I still want her to go to school. She needs that interaction and she may do better than K was in school. A is very independent and willing to learn. Having to teach both of them throughout one school year will be very challenging for us all.

Thank you for pointing out I'm overreacting and bring me down a couple notches. As much as I want to protect her from everything negative our society offers, I'm not really protecting her am I? I'm only hindering her later on in life. Now that you reminded me that she's a fighter, I don't think she'll have any problems in school with kids teasing her. If anything I'll be the one getting a phone call because she hit, pushed, or pulled someone's hair. If what she does to her older sister when she is picked on is any indication, A won't put up with it. She's still about two years away from starting school and a lot can change in that time frame.

If she does develop a passion for whistling I'm going to find a new fashion accessory called earplugs!

Now I am going to stop my whining and micromanaging every little thing.

I want to make this experience fun for her and not scary. Afterwards, I want her to feel good about herself and be happy. I'm going to get her to pick out her favourite colour of jello and get a few packages of it to make her a jello cake and we'll have a little party at home before the Tooth Fairy makes her very first visit to our house.

Becuase A's procedure is surgical if anyone has any recommendations on what I should ask, please let me know.

[Angeló]

i hope everything goes well <3

when i was about 21 my two front teeth were eroding on their own and i had to put a crown on them 

my mom had the same problem when she was that age

 

[Panthersclaw]

15 hours ago, Mouseykins said:

Because A's procedure is surgical if anyone has any recommendations on what I should ask, please let me know.

I would ask them: how long should you wait before giving her food/drink after the surgery, if they have any medication they recommend for post surgery pain for her age, and what problems to look out for. As for food I would recommend smoothie-ing things to make it easier, since she is losing quite a few teeth.

Most kids at 6, don't make fun of other kids for missing teeth. They either think it's cool, or they might have some missing too.

[Mouseykins]

6 hours ago, Panthersclaw said:

I would ask them: how long should you wait before giving her food/drink after the surgery, if they have any medication they recommend for post surgery pain for her age, and what problems to look out for. As for food I would recommend smoothie-ing things to make it easier, since she is losing quite a few teeth.

Most kids at 6, don't make fun of other kids for missing teeth. They either think it's cool, or they might have some missing too.

They have a Post-Op sheet they included in her surgical package and outlines what to eat and when. They'll also inform me when I can use pain medication for her. In the package, it outlines what I can use as well.

I'm definitely going to inquire about what we need to look for if they don't say so. One of the recommendations is out of town patients to stay in the city overnight. I can't really do that because of Mouse and her condition. She needs her medication 2x a day and I'm the only one who can give it to her. We have to discuss the overnight bit with the dentists' office and see if we can bring her home afterwards. We live 4 blocks from the hospital in our town. I want to check with her doctor when she has her Pre-Op check if it would be alright as long as it's cleared by the dentist. If it's unavoidable and we must stay in the city then we'll just have to figure something out.

[rntracy1]

14 hours ago, Mouseykins said:

They have a Post-Op sheet they included in her surgical package and outlines what to eat and when. They'll also inform me when I can use pain medication for her. In the package, it outlines what I can use as well.

I'm definitely going to inquire about what we need to look for if they don't say so. One of the recommendations is out of town patients to stay in the city overnight. I can't really do that because of Mouse and her condition. She needs her medication 2x a day and I'm the only one who can give it to her. We have to discuss the overnight bit with the dentists' office and see if we can bring her home afterwards. We live 4 blocks from the hospital in our town. I want to check with her doctor when she has her Pre-Op check if it would be alright as long as it's cleared by the dentist. If it's unavoidable and we must stay in the city then we'll just have to figure something out.

Dawn,

I was just wondering how everything is going with YOU. How you are feeling about everything.  As far as schooling for your daughter, hrtbrk is absolutely right.  She will not get teased because she is missing a few teeth.  TRUST ME!  I am a school nurse for elementary school children.  Losing their teeth is the most proud moment of their lives.  They show me all the time, "nurse Tracy, I lost this tooth and this tooth, but this one hasn't grown back in yet........"  By the time she goes to school, it won't be much longer before here adult teeth grow in.  And if you are really that concerned about it, IDK how much they cost, but you can look into what they call Flappers.  They use them in beauty pageants.  Why, I have no idea, because kids lose their teeth and they are no less beautiful.  But when they lose, especially their two front teeth, they feel they need to use cosmetic enhancements.  They order them the flappers to hide the fact that they are missing teeth.  It is something you can check in to.  But honestly, I don't feel it's necessary.  I think she will be just fine.  In fact, she will feel like a BIG GIRL because she lost her teeth before everyone else.  I remember watching everyone lose their teeth, I couldn't wait til I lost a tooth.  I was sooooo jealous.  

Just a question, you have probably already check into this, but is your drinking water fluoridated?  When I lived in CT our water was fluoridated.  When I moved to MA it wasn't.  I didn't know that.  My son's teeth started rotting out of his head.  1st tooth, I figured, we need to make sure he is brushing better.  2nd tooth, Hmmmm, this is very weird.  3rd tooth, something is VERY wrong here.  Since his pediatrician was still in CT, he didn't mention anything.  I was talking about it with another nurse I work with and she mentioned that our water doesn't have fluoride, and said, didn't your pediatrician prescribe fluoride tabs.  I spoke with the pediatrician, told him about it and he prescribed fluoride.  The issue stopped and his teeth stopped rotting.  That is probably not the same issue as your daughter, but I thought I would mention it because I never thought of it and neither did his doctor or dentist!! Good luck Dawn, and believe me, it bothers you more than it will bother her.  But that's just how it is as parents.  Our kids are EVERYTHING and we hurt for them.

[Mouseykins]

29 minutes ago, rntracy1 said:

I was just wondering how everything is going with YOU. How you are feeling about everything.  As far as schooling for your daughter, hrtbrk is absolutely right.  She will not get teased because she is missing a few teeth.  TRUST ME!  I am a school nurse for elementary school children.  Losing their teeth is the most proud moment of their lives.  They show me all the time, "nurse Tracy, I lost this tooth and this tooth, but this one hasn't grown back in yet........"  By the time she goes to school, it won't be much longer before here adult teeth grow in.  And if you are really that concerned about it, IDK how much they cost, but you can look into what they call Flappers.  They use them in beauty pageants.  Why, I have no idea, because kids lose their teeth and they are no less beautiful.  But when they lose, especially their two front teeth, they feel they need to use cosmetic enhancements.  They order them the flappers to hide the fact that they are missing teeth.  It is something you can check in to.  But honestly, I don't feel it's necessary.  I think she will be just fine.  In fact, she will feel like a BIG GIRL because she lost her teeth before everyone else.  I remember watching everyone lose their teeth, I couldn't wait til I lost a tooth.  I was sooooo jealous.  

I am still nervous and anxious about the whole ordeal but I've relaxed a lot. I am trying my very best not to worry and to stay positive. Assuming the worst is not going to help myself or my daughter. I'm focusing on planning things that I need to do for her and the rest of our schedules accordingly. I can't control if kids are going to be mean to her in school, and I can't protect her from it either. There's always going to be someone who is going to have mean things to say, so teaching her how to respond correctly, without the violent acts of hitting, pushing and hair pulling, will better equip her for when she's older anyway. Keeping her in a secluded bubble won't do her any good. From what you and hrtbrk have said about her missing teeth, the little kids her age will most likely think she's cool and be jealous. I know her big sister is going to be jealous! Some of her friends in Kindergarten lost teeth last year and she hasn't yet.

37 minutes ago, rntracy1 said:

Just a question, you have probably already check into this, but is your drinking water fluoridated?  When I lived in CT our water was fluoridated.  When I moved to MA it wasn't.  I didn't know that.  My son's teeth started rotting out of his head.  1st tooth, I figured, we need to make sure he is brushing better.  2nd tooth, Hmmmm, this is very weird.  3rd tooth, something is VERY wrong here.  Since his pediatrician was still in CT, he didn't mention anything.  I was talking about it with another nurse I work with and she mentioned that our water doesn't have fluoride, and said, didn't your pediatrician prescribe fluoride tabs.  I spoke with the pediatrician, told him about it and he prescribed fluoride.  The issue stopped and his teeth stopped rotting.  That is probably not the same issue as your daughter, but I thought I would mention it because I never thought of it and neither did his doctor or dentist!! Good luck Dawn, and believe me, it bothers you more than it will bother her.  But that's just how it is as parents.  Our kids are EVERYTHING and we hurt for them.

I believe our water has fluoride in it. However, that would require her to drink it. I use a fluoride toothpaste and rinse for her so she's getting more fluoride. The scariest part for her is going to be the first few minutes as she's getting the IV placed. I think if I can talk to her and have her look at me she'll be fine. Her big sister had to get blood taken a couple years ago for a blood count and nutrition panel. The lab techs put her on the x-ray table on her side facing me and we just talked to her. We did'ts ay anything about what the other lab tech was doing and she was completely fine. The other scary part for her is going to be waking up and slightly disoriented from the anaesthesia and not having me there when she wakes up. The nurses don't want parents there as the child wakes in case an IV gets pulled out or something. The child is a priority and they will trample parents to get to the child. They'll come get me as soon as I can see her. as much as I"d want to be by her side when she wakes, I understand that they are putting her health and safety first. I can wait a few extra minutes. My girls are my world!

In other news, I should have the 2 remaining estimates from my insurance company later today or tomorrow. They're no longer showing as in progress on my app. Fingers crossed that they're covering everything!

[jellysundae]

I've had nothing useful to add to this, but I've just seen this post on Instagram and it's SUPER relevant so I'm here to share and hopefully help with the reassurance.

[rntracy1]

7 hours ago, Mouseykins said:

I believe our water has fluoride in it. However, that would require her to drink it. I use a fluoride toothpaste and rinse for her so she's getting more fluoride. The scariest part for her is going to be the first few minutes as she's getting the IV placed. I think if I can talk to her and have her look at me she'll be fine. Her big sister had to get blood taken a couple years ago for a blood count and nutrition panel.

I hear ya about the toothpaste and rinse, and that is awesome.  I do fluoride rinse for the kids in school too.  Some of the parents, who give their kids fluoride tabs at home, opt out of the fluoride rinse program.  We try to explain to them, topical fluoride and systemic/ingested fluoride are two different things.  While the topical fluoride is great for your child, they need to get the fluoride into their system and is incorporated into the structure of the teeth and the saliva which continually bathes the teeth, helping to prevent decay.  The topical fluoride helps to prevent and control decay.  If you are unsure of your water's content, you may want to find out.  It isn't only her drinking it but also your cooking with it.  When you boil pasta or make other things like mashed potatoes or cakes and cookies that require water, she is getting the fluoride from the water.  If you make drinks with water, she is getting it from there as well.  They have bottled water with fluoride but you have to read the label as most bottled water does NOT contain fluoride.  If your water doesn't contain fluoride, I will bet you almost anything it is at the very least, contributing to her problems and you may want to nip it in the bud by having fluoride tabs prescribed.  If your water is fluoridated, that's great.  I am only bringing it to your attention because of what I went through with my son.  His teeth were breaking off in pieces.  I had never seen anything like it.  I thought I was a terrible mother.  He brushed every day, morning and night.  Flossed.  Everything, and his teeth just rotted away.

Don't worry about the IV at ALL.  The children's hospitals are trained for that stuff.  They are real good at it.  My son was a preemie so they couldn't circumcise him right away.  I had it done when he was about 2 yrs old.  I was sooooooo nervous, and yes, I know it is an elective surgery, but I didn't want him to be different.  So we brought him to the children's hospital because at 2, he had to have it done under general anesthesia.  Not like my older son, whom my dad watched them do it in the nursery.  Not me!!!! I couldn't watch that.  They let us come into the operating with him until he was under.  THAT WAS HARD!!! I almost wish I hadn't done it, but I had to remember, I was doing it for HIM, not for me.  Uggh!  But you are right, they wouldn't let us in the recovery until he was fully awake.  But it was soooooo long ago, I don't remember much of it other than what I have told you.  You will get through it just fine, and her, SHE WILL BE GREAT!!!!! She will get through it MUCH easier than you will.  Lol.  Yes, listen to hrtbrk and me, we are removed from the situation, plus, we are right. lol.  She is going to be the envy of all the kids having all those teeth missing.  And like I said, it won't be much longer, at that point, til she gets her big girl teeth.  It's natural for mommy to have a tougher time dealing, but it is going to be fine.  Plus, you have all of us here.  

[Mouseykins]

I'm definitely going to look into the fluoride thing with our town office. Just in case it isn't or at low amounts. I never realized that cooking with our water, making frozen juice that you add water too, or giving her some of my iced tea is actually classified as her drinking the water. I just automatically thought she doesn't because she does not drink plain water.

The surgical centre we're going to is not at a hospital. It's like a mini-hospital though how it operates. The staff they have administering the anaesthesia are those from the children's hospitals and that alone makes me feel a lot better.

My husband had an incident at work last week and just talked to the big boss today and informed him that he was away Friday because of our daughter and that she needs dental surgery. I have it scheduled for when he's off work, but just in case they move it I'm getting him to talk to the big boss when he comes down on Wednesday and make sure he'll be able to take the time off that he needs.

We've also decided that if it turns out I need to stay in the city with little A after her surgery in case of complications and such I'll get a hotel room for myself, A and baby S for the night. My husband and K will go home after we're settled in the room and check on Mouse. Get a few hours of sleep and then come back to meet us when we have to check-out. That way someone is there at night and in the morning to give Mouse her medicine. Mouse will just have to suck it up and take it from Dad instead of me. She'll be worried beyond belief about me and the 2 girls being gone. I'm hoping we can just bring her home afterwards so Mouse isn't all worked up and A can be in the comfort of her own home. Of course whatever is best for her though. Getting a room for the 3 of us and having my husband and K drive home and back again to get us is a lot cheaper than getting a room for everyone and putting Mouse up for the night at the vets office.

I just got the best news EVER!! Our insurance is covering everything for A, except for $1 and change. Just have to put down the $500 deposit and we're set to go!

UPDATE: I checked with the dental office and we are cleared to go home afterwards because we're 4 blocks away from a hospital. I'm still going to pack an overnight bag for myself, A and Baby S, just in case it's needed. I'll pack a change of clothes for K as well in her backpack. At least now I don't have to worry about packing a dozen movies and the old DVD player to bring to the hotel.