Inflation of Codestones

[wakka9ca]

Besides, if everyone ramped up to the red stone level, the regular codestones would be probably be next to worthless. Look at how TNT messed up (IMHO) with the new faeries. Most types are pretty much below 1k, While the Light Faeries are maybe 8x the cost of the cheapest other types, or an even higher multiple at times. granted it's nice tehy came down from 60k+. But there's really no price balance in place for them, and most of the types of new faeries aren't of much use. it restricts rather than grows. You know?

 

 

There has to be an order to things, otherwise there would be only chaos. Besides, if you just battle, or play keyquest and train with codestones you win, saving your red codestones until you get to that training range, then by the time you are finally AT level 250, you should have a mess of Red Stones saved up and not have to buy ANY codestones for a good long time while you're training. On top of that, because other people are below level 250 and need regular codestones, you can SELL the regular ones you get from random events and the battledome. So that not only are you SAVING NP by not having to buy Red Stones, but you ALSO will be making NP by selling the regular ones.

Thanks for the reply. I think we should have a good discussion/debate on this...

 

First, the order of training should shifts depends on the market price of the codestones. Just like everyone used to train HP higher than 2xLV until they reach close to the next bracket of training in order to save codestones, I don't think it's not wrong or impatient to train for levels only past LV100. It's not really a time issue but more a NP issue.

 

Talking about patience, I totally understand what you mean. Soon receiving the 11 years badge, I certainly don't mind training for 2-3 more years, assuming NP is still alive by then. Here I am just making a point right now that you save more NP training with red codestone past a certain point. Even before the deflation of red codestone prices, this was true. Even if the red codestone price goes up again, you can sell regular codestone to buy red codestone, etc. Then again, I might be biased because I personally do not mind the old red codestone price because I have a very high income of NP. Maybe that's why I have a tendency to suggest gambling on the current market.

[siniri]

When I moved from regular to red codestones, it was close to a wash whether reds or regulars were cheaper (at the max training school level vs. 1 red). If you're at level 100 and ramp up as fast as possible to 250, it'll take months. And you're banking that not everyone at your training level (and above) is doing the same thing. By the time you get there, the majority of those training could be in reds -- and there are a lot fewer reds released every day than regulars. And as people move to the higher and higher red training levels, the demand for reds will only continue to increase. Increased demand = increased price. Meanwhile, the demand for regulars will decrease, decreasing their price. By the time you get there, it may not pay off any more, and you could either level back down (wasting all that time and NP, but saving on all your other trainings), or be stuck paying more for all 3 stats. at least you'd be able to train very often -- if you could afford it.

 

If I were level 200+, I would probably jump into reds early. If I were below 200, I'd be pretty leery of the inflation flipping on me before i could get to reds, and then get stuck paying more (in either reds or more regulars). Then again, I know how many years of consistent training it took to get my stats to where they were.

 

Reds are falling pretty nicely again, I think as people sell more to make up for having to buy regulars. Zeds can be found for under 15k occasionally, and I've gotten some of the others at under 5k.

[wakka9ca]

When I moved from regular to red codestones, it was close to a wash whether reds or regulars were cheaper (at the max training school level vs. 1 red). If you're at level 100 and ramp up as fast as possible to 250, it'll take months. And you're banking that not everyone at your training level (and above) is doing the same thing. By the time you get there, the majority of those training could be in reds -- and there are a lot fewer reds released every day than regulars. And as people move to the higher and higher red training levels, the demand for reds will only continue to increase. Increased demand = increased price. Meanwhile, the demand for regulars will decrease, decreasing their price. By the time you get there, it may not pay off any more, and you could either level back down (wasting all that time and NP, but saving on all your other trainings), or be stuck paying more for all 3 stats. at least you'd be able to train very often -- if you could afford it.

 

If I were level 200+, I would probably jump into reds early. If I were below 200, I'd be pretty leery of the inflation flipping on me before i could get to reds, and then get stuck paying more (in either reds or more regulars). Then again, I know how many years of consistent training it took to get my stats to where they were.

 

Reds are falling pretty nicely again, I think as people sell more to make up for having to buy regulars. Zeds can be found for under 15k occasionally, and I've gotten some of the others at under 5k.

 

It's not actually accurate to say that the demand for regular codestones will decrease, since there will always be new pets that want to train. The price might stabilize but there is no particular reason the demand will decrease.

 

At 6-7 codestones, even with the average price of 6k per codestone it will cost about 40k (that's being very conservative in terms of estimate). Even if the cost of red codestones go to 50k, the shorter training time for reds at lv250 would make up for the increased price. The ceiling of the red price should be close to the total price of the normal codestone (expect to be slightly higher). For example, I am willing (and ready) to pay up to 50k for a red codestone in the future. In the worst situation, even if the cost might end up higher, the training could be faster.

 

In any case, training is simply a matter of how much resource and time you can afford to spend. It's clearly a gamble but far from being an unreasonable one. Personally, I would prefer not to use the training school at all and bank all on faerie quest from fortune cookies.

 

Alternatively, you can hoard all the red codestone right now. I am not a big fan of such market manipulation tactics though, although many users have the potential resources to pull that out.

[Aquamentis12]

Well wakka9ca, not all of us have high NP incomes. I basically get my NP from games and sometimes random events. Neopian Central World Challenge, if there's a game I'm decent enough at in the rotation to get a piece or two. (I'm sick of seeing 3 of the 5 games in there being the same almost every single day when there are so many games in that "world") And sometimes there aren't enough players participaiting the WHOLE day, so I'd only end up with one or two pieces at that.

 

I'm glad the red stones came down, if there were over 100k per, like they used to be. I'd only be able to train a couple times a month at the 1 red stone level. My NP income depends on how much repetativeness I can take, playing the same group of games every day. It gets boring after a few months.

 

I understand people wanting to advance, especially lately. The prices of Terror Trove and Faerie Fortune Scratchcards are still insanely inflated because now people want to level to get faerie abilties. Frankly I think the level-tiered system sucks. They took out the variety of abilties and replaced them with some that while nice, you can expect EVERYONE to want. I preferred the old Faeries system to the new one, even though there was no Lens Flare or Warlock's Rage in the old mix. You had a fairly stable market for bottled faeries and a good selection of abilities to learn. "Variety is the spice of life", as they say. But another thing you gain by wroking on your training at a slower, more even pace. Is that you gain experience in dealing with adversaries. I, myself am a rather impatient person. I also consider myself a decent under-powered budget battler. I hate having to grind for experience in games just to be strong enough to use weapons more efectively, and so when I joined Neopets and found the battledome. I had to be smarter about my battling. The Defenders of Neopia gave me something to focus my battling on. I have some old screenshots, somewhere, of my early victories. And I did it on a very small and tight budget. I came up with weapon combinations that I had never heard of people using. One of my favorite was Double Dryer and Bubble Blaster against an opponent that relies on air-icons a lot. Both reflect air, and the Bubble Blaster has a weak attack of air to add.

People can be resourceful without breaking the bank. Training and equipment also should be balanced imho.

 

I made the dash to 250 after I got my stats to about 436ish. 8 stones once or twice a day for training during the war IS madness. But I was very close to 250 anyway The 8 stones were costing me almost 40-60k per session. (I was getting LOTS of Lu/Vo/Eo stone requests). The only reason I could halfway justify spending that much np was because I had a small stockpile of Leaf Shields from actually doing illusen's Quests. That and I had HOPED the prizes would be worthwhile. So far I'm not impressed with them.

 

I do train via the other methods, including the Faerie Quest Fortune Cookies. Kitchen Quests, Scratchcards, not from player shops unless the prices come down though. ;) You can also get strength sometimes from Turmaculus, Etc. the only thing that can train I don't use, is the Lab Ray.

 

Red stones go to 50k, and I'd probably do one training session a week, if not bi-weekly. I just don't bring in enough NP to justify that and other things I want or need to do.

 

I have ONE hidden Tower weapon in my arsenal, the G-Bomb. The rest are all from different price tiers. Even though I don't have equipment as strong as my pet is now, I still had over 9k wins in the Obelisk War, and About 400 losses, 391 of those being against the "Surprise" attack from Envy. (The Order's surprise attack opponent) I'm just illustrating that you can do more with less if you have to. ;) heck, if I can do it, anyone can. Just takes a little imagination and some research in the battlepedia. ;)

[wakka9ca]

It does take years of effort to both train your pet and get good equipments. I can see years of dedication in your account :)

 

Right now, I am aiming for HT-grade freezer and healer, which will total 20mil+... It will probably take me about 25 weeks to become comfortable enough with my bank account to spend that money. I hope the price will not inflate by then (fingers crossed).

 

Overall, in the grand scheme of things, we can agree that it's still too early to determine what exactly will be the price of the red codestone in long term. The BD is still in BETA, which means that those nifty faerie abilities might get changed in the future. So I guess the conclusion for the more prudent will be... to wait. Wait until everything stabilize and the BD comes out of Beta (if it will ever come out of it but this is TNT...). I also wish the training system would be cheaper than it currently is. Wished they had the Academy for higher levels using dubbloons instead :S.

[Aquamentis12]

*nods* First off thanks. While I have taken multi-month long hiatuses from Neo over the years. I do keep returning, looking for old friends and new challenges. That's why I keep training and playing. I am pretty dedicated. I've always known it, but it's nice to hear someone say it. lol. ;) I'm sure you're dedicated to even though I don't know your account. You certainly argue your point with enough conviction. ;)

 

It's too bad PB's have slacked off in value, or I would recommend you take a shot at the World Challenges. Or Anchor Management. I got a Pirate PB there last week. But found they've diminished in value to 600k. The last time I got hold of one, they were about 3-3.2mil. BIG deflation there. LOL Disappointing too. >_o I actually used the one I had several years back to get my freezer, a Golden Peophin Harp. If it weren't for that, I probably would not have gotten it when I did. I didn't really use freezing techniques before I got the harp, and I collect peophin items, when i feel I can afford to. ;) So, killed 2 birds with one PB, you could say. lol

Depending on your level, you might be able to wait on the expensive healer. If you are going to zoom to the red stone levels, get to 300 and you could get one of the healing abilities there. I'm almost ready to get healing fire, then switch to Regeneration (save some of those Light Faerie Blessings I've got. LOL)

 

Yes, we can agree on those points. BETA means it could be awhile before TNT is done tweaking the BD to fit their twisted designs. ;) Although giving them the ability to use lens flare 6 times in a row is pretty excessive imho. (Happened to me during the war. lol)

 

Yeah, the training, especially regular codestone should be cheaper imho. Reds are good where they are, at least comparitively right now. But yeah, and dubloon training levels extended would be nice. When I learned about the Traiing academy, I was already almost out of it's training range. I just hadn't been to Krawk Island enough to know about it, or the use of dubloons. LOL But I did get some excellent bonus points there before I got out of the academy's level range.

I think it's NICE that the academy offers free training on pet-species' days. But it would be nice if the other training schools, Mystery and Ninja, would at least give a time discount for those of us who can no longer go to The Academy. It'd be like having one of those training cookies for 1 day, the way I am imagining it. ;)

 

Anyway, good debate. lol I wasn't really looking for one, but I guess this one turned out ok. ;)

 

Got some boon-battling to do yet. I was focusing on the weaker opponents a bit. (50 for each of the non-faction leaders for today) I needed a break from the Prof and Kanrik. But now it's time to go back at them. :-\ I want to add 50 more wins against each of them, but if there's time and I'm not feeling battle-fatigue, I might try to up that another 50 for each. But that's in the pipe dream phase. LOL I AM tired of battling so much on these guys. if we were still in the war, I'd have over 10,000 battle notches on my wand. LOL I'm at 1200 victories 2 draws and 2 losses total for this post-war skirmish. Hard to believe, but the old Battledome I didn't even have 3,000 battles in the 9 years I've been on neo. but I've gotten just under 13,000 battles in the BETA Battledome. lol Some would call me crazy for that. ;)

 

Whatever faction you're battling for, I hope you have some good times with it! Later! :)

[wakka9ca]

Thanks for the encouragement for the obelisk war. I am too fed up with it after suffering the same 6-flare-lens-in-a-row bug you encountered. Unfortunately, my amount of dedication is idling for 80% of year doing nothing but collecting bank interest. I check in December every year to collect advent calendar but that's about it. Due to being too busy I missed 90% of the plots in the past 11 years (only did a bit of Meridell War, a bit of Lost Desert and then Faerie's Ruin). Only picked back recently because I'm relatively less busy...

 

Let's see how long I can last this time before going into hibernation mode again. I hope to at least participate in this year's ACVIII.

 

EDIT: oh right, most of my wealth comes from farming Habitarium for a long time. Almost forgot to mention that important point. I purchased my HT weapons using NP farmed through Habitarium. Initially, I was pretty surprised on how easy it was to get a few millions per month just through Habitarium.

 

Anyway, now back on topic about codestones :)

[Aquamentis12]

Yeah, it's sadly not a bug, but something TNT is letting go, as it's up to us to work around it. Kanrik gave me my first unintentional loss in the obelisk war. It was like, 4 tempests in a row, and than 2 later in the battle. Still, he's easier to take out (1-shot) than the Prof is. Because the Prof uses Burrow so darn much. Just got done with my boon-skirmish battles. PHEW! 1300 wins, 2 losses and 2 draws. (for the 4 day total) My wrist is like cooked pasta. LOL

 

I've done similarly with my breaks from Neo, always for several months, and I'd usually come back for the Advent Calendar. Maybe game a bit around that time, and say "hi" to my guildies. But after the last time I came out of "retirement", around a year ago. Things started to pick up a bit, and eventually I found TDN. Started poking around the forums a bit, and yeah, it's a nice forum and good people. My guild picked up a bit in activity too, so that helps keep me going with Neo as well. I am almost dreading this years AC. I worked so hard last year and didn't even make All-Star. Rank 16, 938 wins, 0 losses, 0s ties, 8000 total goals. I dont' know HOW people could even get to all-star as quickly as some did. Boggles my mind. LOL And I spent hours daily on those matches. though I didn't do much with the side-games.... That may have done it, but my hands were totally THRASHED from playing Yooyuball. So I didn't play much of the side-games. LOL

 

I've HEARD you can make a lot of NP with Habitarium. I'm only around level 41 though. I haven't been on there much. About once a week to harvest the white gems from my p3s and that's about it. I'd like to get more into it, but this old computer is slowing down a bit. :-\

If I could make a few mil a month though, I'd still be thrifty, but I could afford to be. LOL But it would be nice to make more than a few mil a year, not counting bank interest. lol ^_^;

 

Have a good one! And to bring this back onto topic, just paid a few k more for a Zed than my last one. about 14.5k. And here I was hoping they'd keep going down in price. LOL

[Clumsy rockyroad1]

Oh yeah, when Habi started, I bet several items inflated massively. Too much NP in the very imbalanced Neopian economy.

[katedid85]

I've been getting a lot of them from the battledome. You can get up to 15 items a day and I would say about 1/3 to half have been codestones and weak faeries.

[Aquamentis12]

I've been getting a lot of them from the battledome. You can get up to 15 items a day and I would say about 1/3 to half have been codestones and weak faeries.

Right on the number of items per day, but so far the battles I've been logging on my current opponent, Tax beast, I rarely get any codestones, sometimes a couple of weak faeries. I think it's random, against the last opponent I was collecting data on, Jelly Chia, I had more days of getting 3-8 good items (Codestones/Faeries/Misc. Treasures) TNT MAY have changed the rates or something after the war ended. Because it seemed to me like Really USEFUL prizes were getting slightly more scarce, at least for me, since that time.

 

Still more data to be collected I guess. lol

 

Glad you're getting a lot of good stuff from the BD. ;) I sure as heck am not, at least not lately. ;) lol

 

Have a good one. :)

[LAkeena]

Right on the number of items per day, but so far the battles I've been logging on my current opponent, Tax beast, I rarely get any codestones, sometimes a couple of weak faeries. I think it's random, against the last opponent I was collecting data on, Jelly Chia, I had more days of getting 3-8 good items (Codestones/Faeries/Misc. Treasures) TNT MAY have changed the rates or something after the war ended. Because it seemed to me like Really USEFUL prizes were getting slightly more scarce, at least for me, since that time.

Not sure if they have changed things. I mainly battle the Mutant Walein and the best haul I had a could of days ago was something like 6 regular codestones, 5 faeries, one red codestone and a couple books/ other useless items to make up the 15.

If anything has changed it is the amount of red codestones that are given out in the dome of the deep. Used to get one to two a day but now it is hovering between none and one with the exception of 2.

Looking at this I am glad I decided to remain patient and continue training at the academy even though I am at 6 codestones there now. I just make sure I never have to buy more than one or two of the codestones asked for and get the rest from the battledome and other events.

With more pets heading for the ninja school I would expect red codestones to go up again over time. Afterall there is no other option once you reach there to train in terms of higher level pets heading to yet another type of school.

[Clumsy rockyroad1]

Not sure if they have changed things. I mainly battle the Mutant Walein and the best haul I had a could of days ago was something like 6 regular codestones, 5 faeries, one red codestone and a couple books/ other useless items to make up the 15.

If anything has changed it is the amount of red codestones that are given out in the dome of the deep. Used to get one to two a day but now it is hovering between none and one with the exception of 2.

Looking at this I am glad I decided to remain patient and continue training at the academy even though I am at 6 codestones there now. I just make sure I never have to buy more than one or two of the codestones asked for and get the rest from the battledome and other events.

With more pets heading for the ninja school I would expect red codestones to go up again over time. Afterall there is no other option once you reach there to train in terms of higher level pets heading to yet another type of school.

 

Nah. I got 3 red a few days back. But I have yet to recieve a Zed in like more than 2 weeks.

[Welcome Back Apathy]

I hardly ever get red codestones. Which is funny, because I use the red codestones but get the regular codestones all the time. I do think that the red codestones are becoming rarer--which stinks for me, but I think it's much fairer overall. Why should it cost more to train a level 40 pet than a level 250? :P

[LAkeena]

Nah. I got 3 red a few days back. But I have yet to recieve a Zed in like more than 2 weeks.

curious, zed's are the ones I get most of. Had one today.

[katedid85]

Do you think the number of codestones and red ones has anything to do with the level of your pet? My chomby is around level 35-40 in all the stats. I have been fighting the clown chia in the battle dome for quick fights. Yesterday was a very good day for code stones. I think I got around 6 regular and 2 or 3 red ones.

 

 

Okay, I spoke way too soon. I just did another round of battles and only got one codestone and one faerie this time. :(

 

 

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[Rebecca~]

I have received one red codestone basically since the war ended. :( I hate not having a stockpile in my SDB!

[Aquamentis12]

I've had a couple Red stones since the war ended Rebecca, and sadly I have no stockpile left either. I did have a number of them before the war, but with training as fast and furiously as I did during the war, they're all gone. :( THANKFULLY I haven't had to buy 2 Zeds for one course, YET. It'd be nice if more red stones came back into the market, but right now, I think the Eo, Lu and Vo stones (regular) are all at least on par with the price of a Zed (red).The other 5 red stones are all under 10k each from what I've seen, some around 5k-6k, so it's not a bad range, I just wish they were cheaper anyway! ;)

[Clumsy rockyroad1]

Price Check:

Vo: 13.2k (-0.3k)

Eo: 14.3k (+0.95k)
Lu: 12.6k (+1.7k)
Zei: 9.5k (+0.7k)

Tai-Kai: 5.5k (+0.2k)

Har: 4.5k (+0.4k)

Orn: 4.6k (+0.3k)

Main: 4.2k (+0.1k)

Bri: 4.8k (+0.8k)

Mau: 4.3k (+0.5k)

Total: 77.9k (UP 5.35k in 166 HOURS)

You know what this means...

[siniri]

You know what this means...

I should be glad I didn't price the ones in my shop yesterday? :D

 

I've been getting the usual number from Koi Warrior post-war. Just yesterday, I got 4 reds. One day, I got 2 zeds, and I've only had to buy 1 zed in the past week (I use 6 reds per day, when I can get to my computer in the middle of the day, which is most days). But when zeds shot up, I was asked for a zed every training and only got one from Koi Warrior. I think I typically ~2-3 reds per day, but sometimes I only get 1 or none. Very rarely do I get 4 (or more).

[Clumsy rockyroad1]

I should be glad I didn't price the ones in my shop yesterday? :D

 

I've been getting the usual number from Koi Warrior post-war. Just yesterday, I got 4 reds. One day, I got 2 zeds, and I've only had to buy 1 zed in the past week (I use 6 reds per day, when I can get to my computer in the middle of the day, which is most days). But when zeds shot up, I was asked for a zed every training and only got one from Koi Warrior. I think I typically ~2-3 reds per day, but sometimes I only get 1 or none. Very rarely do I get 4 (or more).

 

No. I meant. me, one who buys codestones for training, has decreased purchasing power of codestones.

[karmacow]

I've been getting more (basic) codestones from Jetsam Ace lately - and no nerkmids. I wonder if they've swapped nerkmids from codestones in the loot table. If so, I have mixed feelings about it. Of course it's nice to get codestones, so I don't have to rely on user shops but I prefer nerkmids.

[perrin]

I've been getting more (basic) codestones from Jetsam Ace lately - and no nerkmids. I wonder if they've swapped nerkmids from codestones in the loot table. If so, I have mixed feelings about it. Of course it's nice to get codestones, so I don't have to rely on user shops but I prefer nerkmids.

I received two nerkmids yesterday and one today from him, while only getting two codestones from him. It just sounds like you've been unlucky in getting nerkmids lately.

[karmacow]

Thanks for helping me shed light on the nerkmid issue. I'm glad it's just because I've had bad luck. Hopefully I'll have some better luck soon.

[Rebecca~]

I too have been getting Nerkmids still- usually one a day. Almost no codestones at all, and no reds to speak of at all.

-sigh- Less than 20 in my SDB total now.