On Censorship and Free Speech in Neopets

[neopets98]

Half the time, I'm more annoyed at WHICH innocent word tripped the filter than anything else. I agree that the limitations are too harsh and a bit of a joke, but what does everyone expect? Neo IS mainly a kid site. Sure, words like skill and grape and drink being blocked are ridiculous, but it is what it is. Griping about it won't change anything. Technically, you did agree to Neo's terms when you signed up.

 

Besides, writing out a long, thoughtful Neomail, only to have it shut down by a mystery word and having to figure out which word was the possible no-no word is a lot more of a hassle than sending in tickets over and over.

 

All that being said, there's way more freedom over here on TDNF. A person can always mainly talk over here. We're nice. We don't over critique everything, but you just can't take it too seriously rash if you get warned and you know you were in the wrong. In that case, you deserve being called out, so I agree with Shelley, try to avoid possible trip words all together, follow the rules the best you can, and all will be fine. :)

I agree that neopets should have censorship because it is mainly a kid site. I was a kid when I started playing, and I think most people are kids when they start playing neopets.

 

But I also agree that neopets is overly strict on the words they don't allow. My friend chose a username with something that started with "fatcats..." and her account was frozen. There was nothing inappropriate in that.

[esem17]

my favorite get around is using *dung* for well.... the obvious.

 

 

or the alternative is create a code speech heerw vryee dorw si mbldjeu keil eliv thade!!

[jally_muse]

not sure which side of this debate I am on :shiftyeyes_anim:

:offtopic: any way, it was mentioned a bunch of times in this thread that most of neopets users are adults. Just out of curiosity, where did you get that info? I would be highly interested in looking at the age demographics of neopets. I would also be very interested in demographics of those who buy neocash. Any idea where I could find that information?

 

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[jorydan_dopeaf]

Neopets is a site that is for kids (regardless if the users may be a bit older than who they are attempting to market to) and they must still cater to that.

I do agree that the filtering is horribly strict, maybe lessen it a little bit in the nm's or at least give some user options for the filters.

 

The main reason that I was allowed on neopets as a kid myself was due to the strict filters, my mom was certain that I was not able to give out any personal information and that no one would be able to get it from me either. It makes parents more comfortable knowing that their children are pretty safe on the site even if they lie about their age and get onto the boards.

[brynchilla]

There's a common misconception about the freedom of speech. You can say what you want. But it doesn't protect you from the backlash or what people might say.

It doesn't protect you from getting in trouble for saying it.

So on Neopets, you can say whatever you want.

But that doesn't mean you'll get away with it.

[1_holly]

Although it annoys me now as an adult that the rules on what you can/can't say are so strict I think it is sensible to have them in place. When I was younger my mum was very worried that I would see 'inappropriate' things online and I think a filtering system like the one neopets has is quite good as it is so easy to lie about your age :)

[lovedwallflower]

I agree with the OP wholeheartedly. I often think about how fun it would be if TNT started marketing and angling its site towards a slightly older audience (14+ maybe?) Most of their players are much older than that anyway and I would assume that there is no kid who is intrigued by neopets because it's so gosh darn safe.

 

If anything, I would hazard that the squeaky clean image might be preventing young players from joining up. Today's 'inappropriate' is not what it was, and kids know way more than we would give them credit for.

[Mumtup]

I completely understand where TNT is coming from and their reasons for rules to protect younger users. But the strict filters are ridiculous and (in my opinion) unnecessary. I tried to write 'fickle' the other day and it said it was profanity. I still can't figure out why. I have gotten a warning that I disagreed with but some part of me understands why I got it. I was describing a grape and called it a 'fruiting berry used to make an adult beverage' and got a warning for talking about alcoholic drinks. Just admitting something exists isn't the same as talking about it in a way that promotes it.

[brynchilla]

As many have said before, the filters are just crazy. Instead of protecting people, they end up doing the opposite.

When they block words and the people aren't sure what's wrong, they look them up. And then learn new bad words.

I think there's something wrong there...

[Mumtup]

As many have said before, the filters are just crazy. Instead of protecting people, they end up doing the opposite.

When they block words and the people aren't sure what's wrong, they look them up. And then learn new bad words.

I think there's something wrong there...

You're absolutely right! We just end up learning new bad words. I still can't figure out why they block fickle and uncle though. I mean 'uncle'? What's bad about that?

[brynchilla]

You're absolutely right! We just end up learning new bad words. I still can't figure out why they block fickle and uncle though. I mean 'uncle'? What's bad about that?

 

Uncle is a really old thing. I had to look it up when I first found about it.

 

To 'say uncle' is a sign of submission. The bully would hold someone in a headlock or be mean and wouldn't stop until the person they were bullying said uncle. It comes from the Irish word 'anacol' for mercy.

[Musical_Shoyru]

 

I strongly believe that TNT is overly harsh in terms of what they deem to be 'bad words'. I have received a warning for saying 'cigarette' (Not encouraging the usage of that substance but whilst chatting to a neofriend) and a neofriend of mine has received a warning for saying 'drink' - as in DRINKING TEA. She has sent a ticket and received a reply - they acknowledge it's a mistake, but refuse to remove the warning. I understand TNT's concerns - any minor could be influenced by the above words in a more unacceptable context - but I truly believe they are overly harsh, ESPECIALLY considering that Neopets is made up largely not of young children, but of young adults and even middle aged women. I talked about this demographics/freedom of speech topic on the Neoboards, but the post was quickly deleted. :(

And it would also be great if they would let us have unscripted chat in Key Quest, but I don't think that's going to happen any time soon, considering how freely they give out warnings for 'bad words' and they freeze everything suspicious

It's pretty much Oceania in 1984 - the Inner Party is TNT, the Outer Party is Neopets users and the Prolls? (Forgot what they're called) are guests to the site.

:sick02: :sick01: :skull:

 

I totally agree! I also think there's A LOT of silly ridiculous rules. I use to be a not as frequent player of neopets, but starting in September I started logging in daily for everyday prizes and OH MY WORD I can't believe the amount of people I've seen getting frozen for even things they didn't do! After seeing all of that I get SO scared to play on neopets and have this nervousness added when playing because I'm scared something will happen or I'll get accused of something. I honestly think things should be simple!

 

When trying to find a list of specific rules I couldn't find them! They don't make it easy, for example, I had no idea NC items couldn't be traded for regular items. I believe that if they're going to make these rules they should be able to be easily found for newbies. I've been playing for over 6 years so I know how to find them now, but I feel bad for the newbies.... I just wish things were simple :(((

[brynchilla]

I totally agree! I also think there's A LOT of silly ridiculous rules. I use to be a not as frequent player of neopets, but starting in September I started logging in daily for everyday prizes and OH MY WORD I can't believe the amount of people I've seen getting frozen for even things they didn't do! After seeing all of that I get SO scared to play on neopets and have this nervousness added when playing because I'm scared something will happen or I'll get accused of something. I honestly think things should be simple!

 

When trying to find a list of specific rules I couldn't find them! They don't make it easy, for example, I had no idea NC items couldn't be traded for regular items. I believe that if they're going to make these rules they should be able to be easily found for newbies. I've been playing for over 6 years so I know how to find them now, but I feel bad for the newbies.... I just wish things were simple :(((

 

Don't be scared! I used to get in trouble A LOT (silenced for 12 days!) but I haven't gotten in trouble since the beginning of the year.

 

The easiest place to find rules is 'contact us', and then click what you're looking for.

About the NC thing, it says at the bottom of the page that you can't do that.

"NC items may not be exchanged for NC, Neopoints, or Neopoint items."

 

 

As for simple, it really is quite simple to ask on the Help Chat. There are plenty of people there who can point those who ask in the right direction.

 

If all else fails, google the question you have.

[HoneyTediz]

I never did understand the ridiculous lengths TNT will go to prevent children from seeing ~~bad words~~~.

 

Sure, having some rules in place is nice and enforcing them to protect kids from inappropriate content is perfectly reasonable.

But you're crossing the line when you warn and freeze people for making references to drinking tea, censoring (your own)

images that say "let it snow," or getting upset when people talk about grape flavored foods.

 

There's looking out for the safety of young fans, and then there's driving people away from talking on Neopets

at all because they don't want to deal with the broken filters.

[brynchilla]

We also have to remember that children aren't as innocent when it comes to swear words and other 'inappropriate' words. There being said a lot more commonly now, and the children already know them. So it's not like we're guarding their precious little eyes from seeing anything bad.

 

And the 'children' on here are at least 13 years old. If not, then they have their parent's permission to be here, and the parents are acknowledging that there might be some things that might not be age appropriate.

 

So let's move from PG9 to PG13 Neopets.

[HoneyTediz]

At the very least, I think there should be a part of the Neoboards that's secluded from those who are younger than 14-16 years

where the restrictions are a fair bit looser. Let's face it, a large part of the site's userbase are in their late teens. And that's speaking to the minimum.

 

While running any website that has socialization features, not just Neopets, all demographics have to be considered.

[TheNeonHyena]

So back when I first started on Neopets when I was legitimately a child under the age of 13, I got a warning for inappropriate words in a roleplay on the forums. I cannot for the life of me remember what exactly it was, but I know it wasn't anything dirty or bad in nature, or at least it wasn't intended to be. Since then I have avoided the neoboards except for posting in the quest forums occasionally to help out, but I never post anything other than shop/usernames and item names/prices, plus thank yous if I'm the person looking for them. I realize full well that they do heavily over-censor the site because their marketing strategy primarily is aimed at young children and nothing on the planet is more psychotic than over-protective parents. The only way to keep every parent completely happy with the site is to come down hard on anyone breaking the bubble of innocence that lies over the place. Given, I think it is strange how inherently violent and shady some of the aspects are (battledome, some of the Haunted Fairgrounds people, various villains and thieves, etc...) and you're not allowed to talk about a lot of things very similar to them in the boards. It's a very extreme way of protecting their own tushies, both financially and legally, but some of the rulings seem incessantly inane and arbitrary for sure. There are plenty of avatar sites out there that do have less restrictive rules if it really bothers you. Of course you can always meet up with your Neopets friends on another site (such as this one) if you're able to explain what you mean without using any buzzwords.

[brynchilla]

At the very least, I think there should be a part of the Neoboards that's secluded from those who are younger than 14-16 years

where the restrictions are a fair bit looser. Let's face it, a large part of the site's userbase are in their late teens. And that's speaking to the minimum.

 

While running any website that has socialization features, not just Neopets, all demographics have to be considered.

A lot of people have asked for something like that, I have as well. TNT can't do that. It's because they have to listen to COPA rules. And you can bet that kids under 13 are going to say they're older than they actually are. I'm not sure exactly what it was about, but basically if it's found out that people younger than the intended age are sneaking onto the board, Neo is going to get in trouble.

 

So back when I first started on Neopets when I was legitimately a child under the age of 13, I got a warning for inappropriate words in a roleplay on the forums. I cannot for the life of me remember what exactly it was, but I know it wasn't anything dirty or bad in nature, or at least it wasn't intended to be. Since then I have avoided the neoboards except for posting in the quest forums occasionally to help out, but I never post anything other than shop/usernames and item names/prices, plus thank yous if I'm the person looking for them. I realize full well that they do heavily over-censor the site because their marketing strategy primarily is aimed at young children and nothing on the planet is more psychotic than over-protective parents. The only way to keep every parent completely happy with the site is to come down hard on anyone breaking the bubble of innocence that lies over the place. Given, I think it is strange how inherently violent and shady some of the aspects are (battledome, some of the Haunted Fairgrounds people, various villains and thieves, etc...) and you're not allowed to talk about a lot of things very similar to them in the boards. It's a very extreme way of protecting their own tushies, both financially and legally, but some of the rulings seem incessantly inane and arbitrary for sure. There are plenty of avatar sites out there that do have less restrictive rules if it really bothers you. Of course you can always meet up with your Neopets friends on another site (such as this one) if you're able to explain what you mean without using any buzzwords.

I think you're being a bit too cautious. I've gotten in trouble a lot of times for what I say, and you just have to watch it. You've changed since the warning, and you're not going to get in trouble just for posting. (This is coming from someone who's been silenced for 12 days before.)

[rosemaryxrue]

I get frustrated with the filter, as well, but I've learned to value safe spaces on the internet. I'm super-happy that I won't accidentally run across various slurs, some of which can trigger me if I'm not prepared. There's so much vitriol elsewhere; let's have this innocent space. I would *love* to get to know some of my guildies better outside of Neo, since we can't talk about larger issues on Neo--like solidarity around LGBT identity, for example. The time I ran into the filter on 'gay' was jarring. I mean, I know it's used in bullying ways a lot, but ... I'm very involved with various social justice issues, and I can't talk about a lot of them on Neo.

 

I think I'm getting wrapped around my own explanation. I guess my point is I'm on the fence. I value the safe space where I won't run into triggering discussions even while I'm frustrated by censoring words like 'uncle' and 'skill'. Is there a way to improve the system? I'm not sure.

[TheNeonHyena]

I guess I don't really view Neopets as a social community as much as I do a place to play games and whatnot, so I'm not as struck by most by the censoring. I don't really feel like I'm missing out on anything by not chatting with people on that actual site. I can understand why others have difficulty with it, but it just seems all around safer to play games and hoard up items on there and leave the socializing to sites like this where the censorship is considerably less stringent but it is still about Neopets.

 

I'm a once bitten, twice shy sort of guy.

[brynchilla]

I get frustrated with the filter, as well, but I've learned to value safe spaces on the internet. I'm super-happy that I won't accidentally run across various slurs, some of which can trigger me if I'm not prepared. There's so much vitriol elsewhere; let's have this innocent space. I would *love* to get to know some of my guildies better outside of Neo, since we can't talk about larger issues on Neo--like solidarity around LGBT identity, for example. The time I ran into the filter on 'gay' was jarring. I mean, I know it's used in bullying ways a lot, but ... I'm very involved with various social justice issues, and I can't talk about a lot of them on Neo.

 

I think I'm getting wrapped around my own explanation. I guess my point is I'm on the fence. I value the safe space where I won't run into triggering discussions even while I'm frustrated by censoring words like 'uncle' and 'skill'. Is there a way to improve the system? I'm not sure.

There are plenty of people who want to talk about things like that, and like to debate over it. There are plenty of people who can stay cool headed and not insult and threaten other users. But it's the few who do that ruin it for the rest of us.

 

It's silly. I (and lots of other people) weren't aware of the uncle thing until Neopets brought it up. I know they're trying to stop people, but they're just teachign them. If it's okay for TNT to use, then it should be okay for us to use.

 

(At least hello isn't blocked anymore! I remember when it was, and a lot of people were coming up with creative ways to great one another!)

 

I guess I don't really view Neopets as a social community as much as I do a place to play games and whatnot, so I'm not as struck by most by the censoring. I don't really feel like I'm missing out on anything by not chatting with people on that actual site. I can understand why others have difficulty with it, but it just seems all around safer to play games and hoard up items on there and leave the socializing to sites like this where the censorship is considerably less stringent but it is still about Neopets.

 

I'm a once bitten, twice shy sort of guy.

 

Okay, chatting is a lot of what I do on the site, either on the HC or in my guild.

 

I'm a once bitten, attack back why did you do that to me sort of person.

 

 

Added: I am a little annoyed at how the mods treat things like this. I've seen people and have been slapped on the wrist right away for posting tiny things that were in no way meant to be anything bad.

 

And then I see someone post something that is very much against the rules and shouldn't be on Neopets... and it goes for a good 15 minutes, and the account is still there. :hmmph: