Let's talk about GAY MARRIAGE!

[Saxen]

It probably has more to do with the current topic at hand than what Neopets has to do with gay bashing. Your life must be ridiculously empty if this is your cure for boredom.

[Welcome Back Apathy]

If you really had nothing better to do, then you clearly didn't actually care about having a neopets account.

 

If this is the only topic you're posting on, then you clearly don't actually care about having a TDN account.

 

If you really pick anti-gay usernames, then you are essentially saying that the most important thing about you is that you hate gay people.

 

JB--you forgot about Alan Turing.

[jumpingbeans]

@Karina: Oh, sorry. Didn't see that. :*

 

@Puzzles: Can you please answer the question? :)

[Puzzles]

If you really had nothing better to do, then you clearly didn't actually care about having a neopets account.

 

If this is the only topic you're posting on, then you clearly don't actually care about having a TDN account.

 

If you really pick anti-gay usernames, then you are essentially saying that the most important thing about you is that you hate gay people.

 

JB--you forgot about Alan Turing.

 

I have social anxiety, and the fact that I'm even posting means something.

I'm not just going to jump into every single topic I see.

 

<3

 

 

@Puzzles: I have a few questions for you.

 

Do you like Harry Potter? No.

Do you like The Big Bang Theory? No

Do you like Doctor Who or Torchwood? No.

Do you like Glee? No.

Family Guy? No

Pirates of the Caribbean? No

The Final Fantasy series? No

The Mona Lisa? No

 

And yes, this is pertinent to the current topic at hand.

[jumpingbeans]

I honestly doubt that you dislike all of those, but I might as well tell you that they all have prominent glbt (Gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender) roles.*

 

What I'm wondering is why you're so against gay marriage/glbt? Is it because society has shunned you/gays? If so, I'm sorry for your loss.

 

However, through this whole topic (yes, I've read it all), I've seen no good arguments against gays. I've seen good arguments in other debates, but none in here.

 

*In HP, Dumbledore has been stated gay by Rowling. Parsons, the actor who plays Sheldon in TBBT, is gay, and, unless I'm wrong, has propose to the boyfriend. In DW/TW, Jack Harkness is bisexual, as are some of his crew. I think Kurt is gay in glee (never watched Glee), multiple characters in Family Guy, including Quagmire, as with the Simpsons. In PotC, Jack Sparrow is gay. Multiple games or the FF series have had glbt scenes, and Leonardo da Vinci was gay. The point is, all of these shows/books/movies/pictures have been made/acted/been glbt, and they all turned out fine (I think. I'm not sure about Family Guy/Simpsons)

[Puzzles]

I honestly doubt that you dislike all of those, but I might as well tell you that they all have prominent glbt (Gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender) roles.*

 

What I'm wondering is why you're so against gay marriage/glbt? Is it because society has shunned you/gays? If so, I'm sorry for your loss.

 

However, through this whole topic (yes, I've read it all), I've seen no good arguments against gays. I've seen good arguments in other debates, but none in here.

 

*In HP, Dumbledore has been stated gay by Rowling. Parsons, the actor who plays Sheldon in TBBT, is gay, and, unless I'm wrong, has propose to the boyfriend. In DW/TW, Jack Harkness is bisexual, as are some of his crew. I think Kurt is gay in glee (never watched Glee), multiple characters in Family Guy, including Quagmire, as with the Simpsons. In PotC, Jack Sparrow is gay. Multiple games or the FF series have had glbt scenes, and Leonardo da Vinci was gay. The point is, all of these shows/books/movies/pictures have been made/acted/been glbt, and they all turned out fine (I think. I'm not sure about Family Guy/Simpsons)

Almost everything on that list is targeted to a young age group.

And social outcasts.

 

And as I 've said before, I'm against gay marriage because I think its wrong.

It may not be that good of a reason.

But my opinions not going to change.

[Welcome Back Apathy]

Almost everything on that list is targeted to a young age group.

And social outcasts.

 

And as I 've said before, I'm against gay marriage because I think its wrong.

It may not be that good of a reason.

But my opinions not going to change.

 

Okay. Your opinion is not going to change.

 

But the fact is, this is the debate chat. The point of a debate is that you present actual arguments. Like I said, I think zucchini is wrong, but that doesn't make it wrong. If you are not going to debate as per the rules listed directly in the debate chat forum, then this is probably not the place to try to get over your alleged social anxiety.

 

If you don't have a neopets account, I don't really see what TDN holds for you.

• Debates should be conducted upon both facts and opinions but not only opinions.
  
• We cannot remove the posts from others if you do not agree with them.
  
• Topic starters may PM a moderator requesting that their debate topic be closed.
  
• Remember to disagree respectfully and maturely and to keep your cool in tense situations.
  

[Puzzles]

Okay. Your opinion is not going to change.

 

But the fact is, this is the debate chat. The point of a debate is that you present actual arguments. Like I said, I think zucchini is wrong, but that doesn't make it wrong. If you are not going to debate as per the rules listed directly in the debate chat forum, then this is probably not the place to try to get over your alleged social anxiety.

 

If you don't have a neopets account, I don't really see what TDN holds for you.

• Debates should be conducted upon both facts and opinions but not only opinions.
  
• We cannot remove the posts from others if you do not agree with them.
  
• Topic starters may PM a moderator requesting that their debate topic be closed.
  
• Remember to disagree respectfully and maturely and to keep your cool in tense situations.
  

 

 

First: I do have a Neopets account

Second: Do you also call out all of the pro-lgbt who don't use facts or do you only call out people whom are anti-lgbt?

& Third: (I'll admit this is a fault of mine, too.) You should realize that some people on the forums could suffer from depression and/or be suicidal. Even comments that aren't generally mean, or hurtful could push them over the limit.. Although, I' will thank you for making me realize that I'm nothing but a ignorant, disgusting pansy who should be shot. <3

[Welcome Back Apathy]

First: I do have a Neopets account

Second: Do you also call out all of the pro-lgbt who don't use facts or do you only call out people whom are anti-lgbt?

& Third: (I'll admit this is a fault of mine, too.) You should realize that some people on the forums could suffer from depression and/or be suicidal. Even comments that aren't generally mean, or hurtful could push them over the limit.. Although, I' will thank you for making me realize that I'm nothing but a ignorant, disgusting pansy who should be shot. <3

 

Yes. I understand that people could suffer from depression and/or be suicidal. That's why the rest of us in this chat try to stop comments like "homosexuality is disgusting". We are trying to save lives here. None of us said anything mean or hurtful. If you are pushed over the limit simply because we ask you respectfully to use facts rather than just say that homosexuality is disgusting, then imagine what you are doing to the gay people of the world.

 

I'm sorry, I didn't know you had a neopets account because you said yours was frozen, and then you said you'd only created it "because you were bored" and wanted to make the message against gay people. I deduced that you had none because you told us as such.

 

Do I call out all the pro-LGBT who don't use facts? Not really. Because everyone pro-LGBT at the very least uses something along the lines of "It doesn't hurt me" and that is a fact. So I haven't yet found anyone who doesn't use facts.

 

And lastly...if you are actually suffering from depression, I am strongly advising you that this is not the place to be. You are only hurting yourself with your own remarks. If you want help with your depression, you should try forums that help with things like that. I'm not telling you to go away. I'm just saying, if actual debate is depressing you, you should try to find a place that doesn't depress you.

 

Like google image search for bunnies.

[jumpingbeans]

If you are suicidal/depressed, I would seriously suggest seeking help. Try a suicide helpline if needed. I have a friend who's depressed/partly suicidal, and it hurts so much when I think about her possibly going. Once, during school, she tied a string around her finger/hand, and left it there all afternoon. By the end of it afternoon, it had turned purple/black/something (I don't remember; I tried to block it out of my mind), and I just felt so sick. It was killing me inside. So, if you are suicidal/depressed, find think of someone who you like/trust/are like by. If you can't think of one, think harder. If you still can't think of one, go and find someone. And then ask them to help you, talk to them. Use a depression/suicide hotline if you must.

 

Getting back on topic, as I've said before, I fully support glbts and glbt marriages, or I call prefer to call them, marriage. If both parties can act and think for themselves, they should be allowed to get married. This means that while two men, or two women, or one man and one woman, can get married, a man and his toaster, a woman and her dog, etc., can't get married. It's just mostly common sense. Why hurt others if you yourself don't get hurt if you don't hurt them?

[passiflora]

And as I 've said before, I'm against gay marriage because I think its wrong.

It may not be that good of a reason.

But my opinions not going to change.

First: I do have a Neopets account

Second: Do you also call out all of the pro-lgbt who don't use facts or do you only call out people whom are anti-lgbt?

& Third: (I'll admit this is a fault of mine, too.) You should realize that some people on the forums could suffer from depression and/or be suicidal. Even comments that aren't generally mean, or hurtful could push them over the limit.. Although, I' will thank you for making me realize that I'm nothing but a ignorant, disgusting pansy who should be shot. <3

You've yet to present a valid case for why gay marriage should be illegal, which is what this debate is about. There is compelling [scientific] evidence that being gay is not a choice. Did you know homosexuality has even been observed in animals? I honestly can't think of a single reason why someone would oppose gay marriage if they're not religious - it's not hurting anyone (in fact, I'd wager that trying to "cure" people of homosexuality is much more harmful than legalizing gay marriage).

 

No one said you're an ignorant, disgusting pansy who should be shot; this is a debate chat and some people have opinions that differ from yours. As everyone else has stated, depression and suicide are serious issues and seeking help is never a bad idea. :) Telling us that essentially anything we say can be taken the wrong way appears to me like a threat to stop disagreeing with you. We are here to exercise our minds, not close them! ^_^

[Puzzles]

Yes. I understand that people could suffer from depression and/or be suicidal. That's why the rest of us in this chat try to stop comments like "homosexuality is disgusting". We are trying to save lives here. None of us said anything mean or hurtful. If you are pushed over the limit simply because we ask you respectfully to use facts rather than just say that homosexuality is disgusting, then imagine what you are doing to the gay people of the world.

 

I'm sorry, I didn't know you had a neopets account because you said yours was frozen, and then you said you'd only created it "because you were bored" and wanted to make the message against gay people. I deduced that you had none because you told us as such.

 

Do I call out all the pro-LGBT who don't use facts? Not really. Because everyone pro-LGBT at the very least uses something along the lines of "It doesn't hurt me" and that is a fact. So I haven't yet found anyone who doesn't use facts.

 

And lastly...if you are actually suffering from depression, I am strongly advising you that this is not the place to be. You are only hurting yourself with your own remarks. If you want help with your depression, you should try forums that help with things like that. I'm not telling you to go away. I'm just saying, if actual debate is depressing you, you should try to find a place that doesn't depress you.

 

Like google image search for bunnies.

 

 

I'm not hurting myself with my remarks.

Making others feel bad, makes me feel good.

<3

 

And I'll try and get some facts to back me up.

 

 

 

If you are suicidal/depressed, I would seriously suggest seeking help. Try a suicide helpline if needed. I have a friend who's depressed/partly suicidal, and it hurts so much when I think about her possibly going. Once, during school, she tied a string around her finger/hand, and left it there all afternoon. By the end of it afternoon, it had turned purple/black/something (I don't remember; I tried to block it out of my mind), and I just felt so sick. It was killing me inside. So, if you are suicidal/depressed, find think of someone who you like/trust/are like by. If you can't think of one, think harder. If you still can't think of one, go and find someone. And then ask them to help you, talk to them. Use a depression/suicide hotline if you must.

 

Getting back on topic, as I've said before, I fully support glbts and glbt marriages, or I call prefer to call them, marriage. If both parties can act and think for themselves, they should be allowed to get married. This means that while two men, or two women, or one man and one woman, can get married, a man and his toaster, a woman and her dog, etc., can't get married. It's just mostly common sense. Why hurt others if you yourself don't get hurt if you don't hurt them?

 

I thought love was love?

Why shouldn't zoosexuals be allowed to marry?

It's not like it's hurting anyone.

And while, yes, animals might not be able to consent through words.

They can through their actions.

 

:(

 

You've yet to present a valid case for why gay marriage should be illegal, which is what this debate is about. There is compelling [scientific] evidence that being gay is not a choice. Did you know homosexuality has even been observed in animals? I honestly can't think of a single reason why someone would oppose gay marriage if they're not religious - it's not hurting anyone (in fact, I'd wager that trying to "cure" people of homosexuality is much more harmful than legalizing gay marriage).

 

No one said you're an ignorant, disgusting pansy who should be shot; this is a debate chat and some people have opinions that differ from yours. As everyone else has stated, depression and suicide are serious issues and seeking help is never a bad idea. :) Telling us that essentially anything we say can be taken the wrong way appears to me like a threat to stop disagreeing with you. We are here to exercise our minds, not close them! ^_^

 

Yes, homosexuality has been observed in animals.

However, most of these pairs break it off, when a suitable mate of the opposite gender is found.

Look at Roy and Silo.

 

 

And I'm not going to seek any further help when it comes to my depression or being suicidal.

It's my body, and my choice.

Although, apparently that only applies when it comes to abortion.

Besides, I'm starting to think antidepressants are placebo's.

They've never worked for me.

[jumpingbeans]

I thought love was love?

Why shouldn't zoosexuals be allowed to marry?

It's not like it's hurting anyone.

 

 

Well, because the animal can't speak for itself, it can't say whether it wants to be married or not. However, replace 'zoosexuals' with 'homosexuals' and - Voila! - you've just given us a perfect argument for homosexual marriages. :)

[Puzzles]

Well, because the animal can't speak for itself, it can't say whether it wants to be married or not. However, replace 'zoosexuals' with 'homosexuals' and - Voila! - you've just given us a perfect argument for homosexual marriages. :)

 

They may not be able to consent through words.

But they can consent through their actions.

And besides, animals haven't given consent when it comes to being eaten.

Does this mean that we should stop eating meat?

[jumpingbeans]

True, but can actions alone (and keep in mind, they may not even be aware of what there actions mean. I'm no expert on animals/zoology, but I'm pretty sure most animals are less intelligent than humans) really show that you want to marry someone? And consent is 99% of the time words, and 1% not words (for the mute) [don't quote me on these statistics, I'd just making them up on the spot]

 

And you are welcome to become a vegetarian; I don't object to the act of vegetarianism, but I just like meat more. I have several good friends who are vegetarian. However, using that logic, if plants could talk, do you think that they'd like to be eaten? Therefore, humans would have to survive on rocks and air and water. But wait! Wouldn't they not want to get eaten, given thought and the choice? So, humans have to eat living things, just because we need to survive.

[Puzzles]

True, but can actions alone (and keep in mind, they may not even be aware of what there actions mean. I'm no expert on animals/zoology, but I'm pretty sure most animals are less intelligent than humans) really show that you want to marry someone? And consent is 99% of the time words, and 1% not words (for the mute) [don't quote me on these statistics, I'd just making them up on the spot]

 

And you are welcome to become a vegetarian; I don't object to the act of vegetarianism, but I just like meat more. I have several good friends who are vegetarian. However, using that logic, if plants could talk, do you think that they'd like to be eaten? Therefore, humans would have to survive on rocks and air and water. But wait! Wouldn't they not want to get eaten, given thought and the choice? So, humans have to eat living things, just because we need to survive.

 

Comparing intelligence between species is difficult.

But seeing as humans are willing to start wars over religion.

. :whistle:

 

And yes, while plants may be alive

They can't feel pain ...

And some have adapted to being eaten.

It's how they achieve seed dispersal.

 

Don't get me wrong, though.

I love eating animal produce.

But theres simply no reason to consume it. (besides for pleasure)

We can survive without.

[jumpingbeans]

Humans are intelligent enough to start wars over religion. This is actually something that requires a lot of intelligence, even though it's awful. First, religions have to be created. And a religion needs to be well-known and 'good' for others to join the religion. Then, humans need to go and say 'Hey, that religion sucks!'. And then they need to be smart enough to gather supporters, and then get weapons and people and fight. It would actually be one of the things that requires the most intellect.

 

Or can plants feel pain? Maybe they actually do feel pain, but can't express it...

[Puzzles]

Humans are intelligent enough to start wars over religion. This is actually something that requires a lot of intelligence, even though it's awful. First, religions have to be created. And a religion needs to be well-known and 'good' for others to join the religion. Then, humans need to go and say 'Hey, that religion sucks!'. And then they need to be smart enough to gather supporters, and then get weapons and people and fight. It would actually be one of the things that requires the most intellect.

 

Or can plants feel pain? Maybe they actually do feel pain, but can't express it...

 

Plants do not have nerve cells.

Nor do they have a brain.

More than likely.

They don't feel pain.

[passiflora]

I thought love was love?

Why shouldn't zoosexuals be allowed to marry?

It's not like it's hurting anyone.

And while, yes, animals might not be able to consent through words.

They can through their actions.

Animals are unable to give consent, whether their actions suggest it or not. It's the same reason there's an age of consent for sexual activity and it's why we look down on pedophiles. Children or young teenagers can say they're consenting, but we consider them not to be because they're not fully mentally or emotionally developed yet.

 

Yes, homosexuality has been observed in animals.

However, most of these pairs break it off, when a suitable mate of the opposite gender is found.

Look at Roy and Silo.

There are some animals that show preference members of the same sex, even when given a choice. I think it's irrelevant, though -- my point was that people often view homosexuality as "unnatural", when it isn't. Marriage and all its complexities is unique to humans, anyway. I don't understand why denying two men or two women the right to marry is such a big deal? :eh:

 

Besides, I'm starting to think antidepressants are placebo's.

They've never worked for me.

Antidepressants aren't placebos, but they're not 100% effective.

[Puzzles]

In that sense, animals also haven't given consent to being eaten.

Yet, we still eat them.

Whats the difference?

 

AND even if they're not placebos ... Its still my body, and still my choice.

[hrtbrk]

This is becoming way too off topic. The discussion is about gay marriage, not if animals can give consent to be slaughtered. :rolleyes_anim:

 

Furthermore, Puzzles, you've only refuted your own "rebuttal" on the topic many times so I'm going to conclude that you're only here to try and rustle feathers but are failing to do so.

 

As you've said "Its still my body, and still my choice." Amen. And it should be gay people's choice to marry as well because it is their body and their life and that is their choice.

[Puzzles]

This is becoming way too off topic. The discussion is about gay marriage, not if animals can give consent to be slaughtered. :rolleyes_anim:

 

Furthermore, Puzzles, you've only refuted your own "rebuttal" on the topic many times so I'm going to conclude that you're only here to try and rustle feathers but are failing to do so.

 

As you've said "Its still my body, and still my choice." Amen. And it should be gay people's choice to marry as well because it is their body and their life and that is their choice.

 

It's distantly related.

If homosexuals should be allowed to marry.

So should zoosexuals.

 

<3

[hrtbrk]

Are you honestly trying to say that two consenting people of the same sex who are trying to marry, is the same thing as one person forcing them self on a defenseless, non-consenting animal into sexual relations or marriage? And you're okay with that? :weird:

 

LOL OH OKAY. :sleeping_03anim:

 

Guess you haven't heard of animal rights or animal cruelty laws and why they are in place, then? Or you were just hoping we forgot such thing exists?

 

They are so painfully not the same thing, I'm getting second hand embarrassment that someone would even suggest that they go hand and hand.

 

Anyway, the topic is about two consenting adults of the same sex being allowed to marry. I've still yet to see a reason from you as to why you are against it other than you think "ew, gross," and I'm starting to think we won't actually get a valid point from you - just other radical subject changes and comparisons so you won't actually have to come up with something worth debating about.

[Welcome Back Apathy]

Making others feel bad, makes me feel good.

 

Guys...give up. This is the mark of a true troll, one who is really not worthy of time or discussion.

 

However, Puzzles, I'd like to thank you for at least trying to present an argument...albeit one we've refuted time and time again.

 

If you are truly someone who has had feelings for the same sex, and you have "cured" yourself as you claim, then your alleged social anxiety/depression only further the long-standing evidence and research that trying to change your sexual orientation is damaging and causes depression.

[Trig]

I realize that we are dealing with a troll here but I'm so incredibly passionate about this topic that I need to express myself. Thank you :)

 

I'm 100% against gay marriage.

 

Homosexuality is something that shouldn't be encouraged..

 

Although, hopefully your friend didn't actually tell his parents.

Somethings are ment to remain secret.

Did he actually try to get over his lust for the same gender?

Or was he one of those who simply never tried?

 

And yes, I chose to be straight.

 

Edit: And before anyone asks, I'm not religious. <_<

Heterosexuality isn't something that should be encouraged either then. Why don't we just let people make their own decisions for themselves? Why are YOU trying to tell OTHER PEOPLE how to live their life? Why can't they love who they love or be who they want to be? I feel quite sorry for you that you had to choose to be straight because you felt internally, and possibly externally oppressed. Honestly there is nothing wrong with you if you love someone of the same sex, just as their is nothing wrong with you if you love someone of the opposite sex. Couldn't I say to a straight person "well, have you ever TRIED to love someone of the same gender?".

 

I had feelings for the same gender.

However I've cured myself .

And no, I'm not denying who I am.

Because, I'm straight.

So yes, homosexuality can be cured.

And therefor, theres no reason for gay marriage to be legal.

<3

Sorry but you can't cure homosexuality- and to be honest, it's not something that needs a 'cure'. It's not a disease and it's natural so stop trying to convince yourself and others that it's not.

 

I have social anxiety, and the fact that I'm even posting means something.

I'm not just going to jump into every single topic I see.

 

<3

This really isn't the place to try and solve social anxiety. On the other hand, if you have social anxiety then you probably enjoy talking on the internet more than in real life so you should be posting on more topics :)

 

First: I do have a Neopets account

Second: Do you also call out all of the pro-lgbt who don't use facts or do you only call out people whom are anti-lgbt?

& Third: (I'll admit this is a fault of mine, too.) You should realize that some people on the forums could suffer from depression and/or be suicidal. Even comments that aren't generally mean, or hurtful could push them over the limit.. Although, I' will thank you for making me realize that I'm nothing but a ignorant, disgusting pansy who should be shot. <3

I think you'll find that the people who are pro-LGBT are using facts- as someone said one of the most common FACTS is "it doesn't hurt me". In any event, you'll find photos, videos, and quotes posted throughout this subject that highlight many facts. Clearly you didn't take the opportunity to watch the video I posted, nor read through all of the posts. And we don't think you're a disgusting pansy who should be shot- I think that's pretty harsh. I do however think you are being pretty ignorant. If you don't approve of being gay, fine, but don't try and shove your beliefs on other people because it doesn't affect you. Just because gay people will be allowed to get married doesn't mean you won't be. Fine if you don't approve of being gay but you should be accepting of it. I accept that you have your belief and don't agree with it- I'm not embracing you in any way because I don't agree with you, but you should be accepting of the fact that people should be able to live their lives without interference from others.

 

Are you honestly trying to say that two consenting people of the same sex who are trying to marry, is the same thing as one person forcing them self on a defenseless, non-consenting animal into sexual relations or marriage? And you're okay with that? :weird:

 

LOL OH OKAY. :sleeping_03anim:

 

Guess you haven't heard of animal rights or animal cruelty laws and why they are in place, then? Or you were just hoping we forgot such thing exists?

 

They are so painfully not the same thing, I'm getting second hand embarrassment that someone would even suggest that they go hand and hand.

 

Anyway, the topic is about two consenting adults of the same sex being allowed to marry. I've still yet to see a reason from you as to why you are against it other than you think "ew, gross," and I'm starting to think we won't actually get a valid point from you - just other radical subject changes and comparisons so you won't actually have to come up with something worth debating about.

Yeah. I'm quite confused to. You're okay with bestiality but not homosexuality? Can you please explain that to me? I'm really not following it. You think it's okay that a man* or a woman* can force themselves upon an animal who cannot share their emotions. Sure maybe they can try and fight against it, but a lot of animals cannot stand up against humans. Please, go read animal cruelty laws. If two people, whether they happen to be of the same gender or not, consent to marriage- why shouldn't they be allowed?

 

*gender is fluid- so really anyone that falls in the gender fluidity- aka everyone on earth*

 

Also: