How Young is Too Young?

[Naamah D.]

I've read alot of articles about children being charged with murder. One of them, a 5 year old, drowned an infant in the bathtub. A 5th grader shot mother or stepmother in the head, and a 15 year old girl dug the grave of her 9 year old victim before she killed her. Two of them, the 5th grader and 15 year old girl may be facing life in prison. The 5 year old may be facing murder charges. So my question is, how young is too young for life in prison?

 

Personally, I think that 5-10 years old is too young to be held in an ADULT prison. The 15 year old maybe, but still they are juvenilles. The 5 year old should have a psychiatric evaluation and be placed in the care of somebody who could possibly help her before it's too late to save her. It was also stated in the articles I read that a 16 year old with mental disabilities was watching the children and the 5 year old was annoyed that the baby wouldn't stop crying so she made him stop. As messed up as that sounds, she probably didn't know better.

 

The 5th grader who is being held in an adult prison, should be kept in Juvenille hall instead of adult. I'm not going into detail but certain things happen in adult prisons that can be terrifying and emotionally scarring for a young boy.

 

The 15 year old is beyond help. Her Myspace and Facebook hobbies were listed as "Killing people". She has a history of cutting herself with her fingernails, and when she killed her victim she kept stabbing the body.

 

What do you think?

[Vivies]

There's no way a 5 year old should be in adult prison. And that wouldn't happen in the US. As for the 15 year old, juvie and mental evaluations, then depending upon the nature of the crime, perhaps adult prison. Basically, I think teens should be in juvie.

[Naamah D.]

There's no way a 5 year old should be in adult prison. And that wouldn't happen in the US. As for the 15 year old, juvie and mental evaluations, then depending upon the nature of the crime, perhaps adult prison. Basically, I think teens should be in juvie.

 

That's what I'm saying. A 5 year old hasn't developed mentally enough to understand right and wrong in that manner. So charged with murder, no. Foster care in a controlled, psychiatric enviorment yes.

[groovyjenny]

Personally, I can't STAND IT when I read that people get their sentences reduced because they are "mentally unstable" and they weren't "in their right mind" when they murdered someone. In the case of the 5 year old kid, sure maybe s/he might have the benefit of doubt. It sickens me to see these people who claim bipolar, mental disability, and other things for killing another human being. I don't care if they're in their right mind or not, their sentence shouldn't be reduced. The 15/16 year old should be tried as an adult, no question about that. S/he knew what they were doing. Seriously makes me sick to my stomach just typing this.

[Bark-Cat?]

I was very surprised by some people's responses. As for me I view it as this. A fifteen year old...

A fifteen year old knows what's right and wrong. And a fifteen year old is only three years away

from being an adult, therefore I believe she or he should face the ADULT consequences. This

fifteen year old is not four or five. A four or five year old does not know any better, but when you

add ten years of experience on to 5 you get 15. This teen knew what she or he was doing was wrong,

she/he just didn't make the smart,good decision. Therefore I believe she should face the music.

 

This kid who's 11.. Same thing he knew what's right and wrong. Although he shouldn't have to go

to adult prison, for there are horrific things that go on there.

 

The five year old should just go to Juvenile Detention for a couple(or several) of years to get her mentally and

emotionally stable.

[Scarlet Fever]

I don't think it's so much as how young one is so much as having a grasp of what they've done; even a very precocious 5 year old isn't likely to grasp the full meaning of what it is to die/kill someone and a 15 year old is nearly certain to understand (I say nearly ruling out certain mental conditions). Either way, they're doing psychiatric evaluations and can get some semblance of what kind of understanding they have and go from there. (Forgive my wording....It's 5am, I've yet to sleep and it makes sense to me. lol). I don't feel that a child without the mental capacity should be tossed on the scrap heap of life and left in some correctional facility until death. It's just not right. I do, however, feel that a good deal of time in a mental clinic, monitoring progress and the like to see whether or not the person can be mentally rehabilitated and may one day be safe enough to put back with the general populace. However, in the case of the 15 year old, I have no issue with them being tried as an adult.

 

Are you sure they're keeping the one child in an adult facility? They typically keep them (typically being, I've never heard otherwise...ever. lol) in some sort of juvenile correctional facility until they're old enough to be moved to an adult prison. I also disagree with you on the 15 year old being hopeless. Don't get me wrong, she's got a deck full of head-crazy, but given the right care, I don't think anyone is "unsalvageable ". Keep in mind: 15...That's a time where the body and mind are going through a LOT of changes, hormone issues and the like...add some mental disorder to the mix and it can make for a scary kid. The body eventually adjusts to this horror known as puberty and the disorder can be managed in some form or fashion; anywhere from meds to a cushy padded room.

 

It's a rough subject, but one I find incredibly fascinating. Last Christmas I bought myself a book about Mary Bell (a woman who had murdered two toddlers at the age of 10/11).

 

 

(Oh gosh, I hope at least SOME of that made sense...)

 

Edit: @ groovyjenny: Claiming Bipolar or some other mental disorder won't get anyone out of anything. If they're aware of the condition, then they are still accountable (treated or untreated)....this isn't taking into account the occasional idiot judge, mind you...

[Chloe.]

I agree with most of the people on here. The 5 year old should be able to get mental help, or put in the care of somebody who could help her, so she understands, and they never even think of doing it again..and just to get her sane again. Because in my opinion, people shouldn't be able to get out of prison sentences by saying there mentally unstable, as anybody who commits a murder and takes somebodies life is surely mentally ill anyway.

 

The 15 year old though, I think should face the consequences of what they've done. They're only a few years from being an adult, and they probably have the same mentality as an adult, so she should be treated as one. Maybe not an adult prison, depending on what it's like there (haven't heard of what happens in there..but I can imagine), but definitely a long sentence, in a juvenile facility until they're 16 or 18, and then moved to the adult prison. But, the 15 year old should be tried as an adult, and given the same sentence as an adult would've got.

 

Edit: @ groovyjenny: Claiming Bipolar or some other mental disorder won't get anyone out of anything. If they're aware of the condition, then they are still accountable (treated or untreated)....this isn't taking into account the occasional idiot judge, mind you...

 

I fully agree with this too ^

[Raj321]

Personally, the 5 year old can still possibly get help before it's too late, but until they do, they should be in a controlled environment or a juvy for younger kids.

The 11 year old should know what they're doing wrong. They need to face consequences, but not sent to an adult prison.

The 15 year old is too late to save and should get 25 to life in an adult prison.

[Callie.]

I heard the story about the 5 year old drowning the infant.

Honestly, I think that that's just horrible and I can never imagine a 5 year old even thinking about doing that..

But yes, I do believe that an adult prison is just a bit too much for a 5 year old.

He should at least be put in juvy. Another option would be to put the child in an insane asylum..

I just can't imagine an innocent child with blood on their hands.. It sickens me.

 

I also read the article on the 15 year old girl. And one of her reasons for killing the little girl was apparently because she 'felt' like it.. This story just sickens me to the very core. She needs to definitely be put in prison for life, no exceptions. She knows what right and wrong is. And she should know that you can't just take someones life like that. There is definitely something seriously wrong with this girl. No ifs ands or buts about it. She needs serious help and needs to be kept somewhere confined for the rest of her days.

[imxsorryxixam]

The 5 year old will be given a slap on the wrist.

If anything the parents should go to jail for child neglect, as they obviously werent watching them.

5th grader-juvenile center.

and 15 year old-Juvenile center till age 18. then adult prison for life. At 15 you know exactly what you are doing and should be charged an an adult.

[dasavo]

Everyone is saying that the 5 year old "didn't know what she was doing", and that she didn't know what was right and wrong. When I was 5 years old, I knew that killing someone was wrong. This 5 year obviously knew that baby in water equals death. Of course, I don't think she should go to adult jail, but she should go through intense psychoanalysis for many many year, and put into foster care until they can figure out if it is the parent's fault that this happened. As for the 5th grader, of course, juvie. For the 15 year old, she should be in juvie until she turns 18, than jail. I don't believe in jail for life though. 25 years, and then released with many restrictions. She should also go through with psychotherapy to figure out why she did this. But jail for life is stupid, it is incredibly expensive for tax payers to keep someone in jail for their entire life, and it really isn't necessary. eventually, they will learn their lesson, probably be put on drugs or go through lots psychotherapy. I believe anyone can feel remorse and be given a second chance for a normal life.

[Mason]

i think it should be based more off their /mental/ age than their actual age.

EX: i have a little cousin. she's 19 years old, but because her mom is a crazy alcoholic who couldn't raise her properly she's got the mindset of a 14 year old. If the criminal has the mindset of an adult (fully knew what they were doing and the consequences--moral and legal--of the crime) then they should be convicted as an adult. if their maturity level puts them at child level, then there should be a lighter criminal sentence with more therapy and rehabilitation.

[megalomaniak]

I believe there was a story that involved a toddler killing his/her baby sibling. I've never actually seen the article (my roommate told me about this one). Either way, toddler+baby were being babysat. babysitter fell asleep. Don't know if they were in the same room or not. toddler did something that killed baby sibling, i think it was like hitting. End result, somebody is trying to press charges against said toddler. Or something. That is rediculous, for sure. Last I checked, toddlers don't understand death. They don't always understand consequences properly. If they poo'd on your couch, and pointed at the stain 2 days later and said BAD! NO! and gave them a spanking, I'm not sure they'd get it. That specific toddler needs a psychiatric evaluation for good measure, and to be watched for a few years and have that incident never mentioned again.

 

Punishment for a 5 year old is really debatable, and the circumstances would need to be examined very very very closely. But I don't really think 5 year olds are capable of premeditated murders, and to fully understand the consequences.

 

As for anything above around 8-9, if it premeditated AND alone, charge them like an adult. If not, juvie until they're 18. I don't know how the US deals with this, but Canada, children below 12 cannot be charged as adults even for 'adult crimes.' There was a 12 year old girl who committed a multiple homicide in 2006. She's getting about 8-ish years in variuos detention centres and thats about it. Not sure what happens after. It was premedited, however, she had external influences, a boyfriend who was 23 and probably not right in the head and/or on drugs. few details have been released about this (or maybe I dont remember?). Had she done this alone, I'd think lock her up. Another story of 2 10 year old boys that abducted a 2year old boy and beat then killed him. The boy whose idea it seemed to be - later arrested on child porn charges after release from his detention centre. other boy? nobodys heard of him since(i dont know much about this case, but wiki isnt telling me much, so I'll assume his life just more or less went on).

 

tl;dr : examine circumstances very closely. if above 8 or 9 and crime was both premeditated and alone, treat them like an adult. they clearly made their own descision.

[Guest Zazi]

I think the more we generalize cases, the less accurate about punishments we will be.

Every case should be looked over with special attention. A 5-year-old doesn't have enough discerniment. Or... maybe this one did. My brother is 5 years old and is scared of killing bugs, even. Either way, he/her should be punished, not to produce guilt or anything, as the parents (or anyone, really) will most likely never know how to act/what to say about this: they were negligent. Just not through jail, as it certainly wouldn't serve for anything.

 

And about reduced sentenced for the mentally ill: a load of people go through unthinkable situations in their lifetime and suffer from inumerous mental deseases and do not have breakdowns, kill people, etc. So I think any sort of mental instability should be considered a trigger rather than what led people to these actions. They don't just do things because they forget it's wrong. Maybe have a psychiatrist accompany and help them, yes, but certainly serve jail-time.

[Squidmama]

I can't stand children being tried as adults. It undermines the whole system :/ They should even raise the age of legal adulthood in my opinion. The brain isn't even fully devolved until you're 25. Just because you can drink, drive, and go see a rated R movie doesn't make someone an adult. Murder is an awful terrible thing, don't get me wrong, but so is a life in jail. I think different things should happen, like house arrest before life in jail, even the death pently is considered. AAa there's this short story called Agnel something by Henry Kuttner where people who kill other people are just followed around by mechanical angels for the rest of their life. And at an undetermined time, kill the person they're sent to follow.

 

But yeah, I don't care how horrid the murder is, if the murderer is underage, they should never be tried as an adult.

[Yuika]

As some other people said, I believe it should be based on some sort of "mental age" as well as a psychiatric evaluation regarding their feelings on the crime. If they seem to feel true remorse, and seem to have not meant what they did, they shouldn't be tried as an adult. There are 13 year olds who are sociopathic and masochistic, and perhaps they should be tried as adults (especially since the trial may not occur until upwards of 2 years later). Then there are 16 year olds who are very immature and do not think before they act, though this isn't really an excuse for murder... The problem with things like these is that there's always a fine line, and laws cannot be exact. It's tricky.

[cokiza]

It's tough to say, but I do agree with the current system in Canada.

[Gensei]

No person under the age of 18 should be tried as an adult for any reason.. If you wanna send a 15 year old away for life, then make it so you can send 15 year olds away for life instead of arbitrarily saying "wow this kid murdered some one just like that other kid somewhere, but we're gonna try this one as an adult".

[Hunoni]

I have to say that 100 is too young! No one should do anything that requires life in prison!!! But that's the problem. Really little kids aren't "in touch" with their consciences so they shouldn't serve life in an adult prison...

[xkiyoz]

I'd say that anyone under 18 is too young. You shouldn't put a teen or younger away for life. They have so much time to change :(

[AKALeenaLean]

Life is such a precious thing, no one should be put to jail for life over one thing, even if it is murder. People focus on the negative too much, but the law is the law. 15 and 5 are both too young to be put to jail for life, they both have so much to look forward to.

 

Murder is such a touchy subject, and people say that time heals, but putting children in jail for life? What kind of of lesson does that teach them? Leave them in jail to think and do nothing about it but think about their actions, and what? Think some more. Help them. Of course people are scared of letting psychos on the loose, but once they've thought about what they've done, they'll think twice. Everyone deserves a second chance.

[Jeanie]

Why was a five year old alone in a bathroom with a infant to begin with? This is the only age I have trouble with saying no to life in prison. Five year olds are just learning the difference between right and wrong, but in this case I do believe whoever was responsible for these two children deserves as much punishment as the child does. The child will need mental evaluation and will probably be considered insane for there whole life. Anyone older that age eight knows what they can do, and can't do. So, the age above that should be given life, but I think we may be missing the bigger picture, why are we talking about prison and not why these children feel that things are so bad in their lives that they have to kill?

 

And yes, people should be put to life in prison, how would you feel if it was your 5 year old innocent daughter who was killed? If ANYONE kills in cold blood, or for money or because they dislike someone, you want them to continue to walk around free? I disagree with the 'think' word in your post too, do you think a 5-year-old is thinking before they drown a baby? Lets help the murders, give them second chances, short jail sentences, and forget all about the victims who were brutalized.

[AKALeenaLean]

do you think a 5-year-old is thinking before they drown a baby?

 

You're giving that 5 year old very little credit at all. Children are smarter than we give them credit for. Kids understand punishment well, but at that moment that they killed that baby, of course they didn't know the consequences of their actions but they do have reason, jealousy, anger, annoyance, etc. Once they did and that child was put to jail FOR LIFE, now what? All that child can do is say sorry. They learned their mistake.

 

Humans focus on the negatives too harshly. The law, society, the media, and that's what makes one time punishments incredibly interesting.

[Jeanie]

The truth is that 90% of people who end up in jail, and then are released end up doing the same thing and going back to jail. Murder is not a mistake, if it was a accident that the child was pushed into the water, then that is a mistake if a five year old got angry or annoyed then that is murder. Plain and simple. And if they can't control their emotions in society they do not belong in society. I can understand getting a few years for stealing a car, or robbery, but for murder if there is a chance that they could go back out and kill someone else, why would you take the chance? A five year old doesn't deserve life, because I don't think when they push a infant in the water or hold them in the water they were hoping to kill them. Probably just wanting attention or a annoying baby to stop crying, it wasn't premeditated murder.

 

 

The 15 year old who dug the grave before killing a 9 year old, thought about the murder, considered it over and over again, and went through with it, just like any adult would, life in prison is too tame a punishment. Children with disturbing tendencies from young age turn into serial killers, rapists and terrorists, if we can stop them from doing this before they started then we are improving life for the greater society.

[AKALeenaLean]

I still believe that 5 year should not have gotten life in prison, their life is too precious and his/her mind is still moldable to guide to the right path.

 

The 15 year old on the other hand might receive torture so she could feel the pain of the parents of the child. Mental abuse should further suffice her mental instability, couple that with isolation from society, they could prove fearful of other humans and no longer harm others.