!!Abortion!! Good or bad?

[Mira]

I don't even know what to say anymore. I say one thing and you guys somehow pick a random thought out of the air to try to use against me.

 

Did I say a man is allowed to decide for a child to have an abortion? Did I? Please quote me where I said that when I said this WHOLE TIME that abortion should be banned. Are you 5 years old? Please think before you post!

 

I also love how you decide not to comment on the more important part of my post that came before that sentence but whatever.

Dude, lay off. We already have all nice people on these forums and I just don't want to start hatred. No, I'm not 5 years old. I'm a teenager in fact. And I reply to things thatI have to say something about. I don't have an opinion on if abortion is good or bad. I'm in the middle. But "important parts" of a post is just an opinion. Someone could think that something is important and others could think it dosn't matter.

[Fuzio]

Closest- Which means that nothing else is closer to death. The very definition of the -est suffix. That means that nothing else will bring a woman closer to death, which means it is very dangerous, than childbirth. How is that not saying abortion is not the closest thing to death therefore safer than childbirth? Idk unless I've been using my -est suffix the wrong way my whole life.

 

How do you possibly know men are the only people debating on this issue. LIKE I SAID IN THE PREVIOUS POST, people such as Hillary Clinton and Condi Rice voice their opinions and influence the decisons that are made not only on abortion but on nearly every political topic too. How about you read what I type and stop denying what you obviously did type.

 

A woman has no right to tell a child whether it can live or not live so therefore abortion should not be permitted.

 

How about you stop acting so "childish" by trying to deny everything that you posted and stop accusing me of "twisting" your words just because I seem to be able to support my view better than yours...

 

 

No, what you're doing to taking what I say into extreme literal terms and reading beyond what I've actually said. Thus, twisting my words. I never said 'abortion should be the choice because it's safer than childbirth.' If you notice, I'm against abortion but I don't feel the government has a right to regulate what a woman can and cannot do with her body.

 

Also, I never said men are the only people debating and deciding on this issue. How about YOU learn to read?

 

Again, you're being very childish. "I support my view better than yours. neener neener neener". Honestly. Instead of reading further into what I say and twisting things, clear your mind and then read.

[WEVIL]

No, what you're doing to taking what I say into extreme literal terms and reading beyond what I've actually said. Thus, twisting my words. I never said 'abortion should be the choice because it's safer than childbirth.' If you notice, I'm against abortion but I don't feel the government has a right to regulate what a woman can and cannot do with her body.

 

Also, I never said men are the only people debating and deciding on this issue. How about YOU learn to read?

 

Again, you're being very childish. "I support my view better than yours. neener neener neener". Honestly. Instead of reading further into what I say and twisting things, clear your mind and then read.

 

Lol wow, it looks like you're starting to run out of ideas?

 

You say that I am taking your writing literally. OF COURSE I AM. What do you want me to do analyze it figuratively and read your mind and find out what you really wanted to say? Maybe just post more clearly instead of just saying I'm "twisting" your words. (You've used that same word way too many times by the way)

 

Again you said the same thing as you did in the above post in that you said you didnt post that childbirth was safer than abortion. If you scroll up and look what you posted, you shall see that you posted that childbirth is the closest a women gets to death. Now is it just me or is this saying that childbirth can very likely cause a women to die? closest to death? What else could it mean? That childbirth is perfectly safe and that a woman is in no danger? Therefore you are obviously saying that childbirth is the MOST dangerous because it is the CLOSEST a woman can get to death. This is what you posted so how can you deny it? If you worded it incorrectly than just say so instead of trying to back up something that your obviously wrong on.

 

Abortion= WAY MORE DANGEROUS THAN CHILDBIRTH. Done.

 

You also said that "My 'men' statement was that most people doing the debating on this issue are men. Most of the people who decide on issues like this are men." So you are saying that women have very little choice in this matter. Because MOST of the people debating on this issue are men and MOST of the people deciding are men. THE DEFINITION OF MOST. This is where you are wrong. Women probably voice their opinion as much as men if not even more than men on the topic of abortion and are a large part of the people who vote on abortion. How can you possibly know and even assume that men make MOST of the decision on abortion?

 

Finally, I belive I did not post "I support my view better than yours. neener neener neener". I posted "How about you stop acting so "childish" by trying to deny everything that you posted and stop accusing me of "twisting" your words just because I seem to be able to support my view better than yours..."

 

Now in your definition you are now acting "CHILDISH" and you are "TWISTING MY WORDS" by "LOOKING FURTHER THAN WHAT I SAID" (because did I put neener neener neener? No). Also you said I look at your posts literally. But now you said in your last paragraph I look further than what you said which means that I don't take your posts literally enough.

 

Seems like just a lot of plain contradictions in your posts. And don't even try to use me using "childish and twisting" against me because you are the one who first decided to post those words to describe me.

 

Now try to get off the topic of trying to deny what you obviously said and try to think of new reasons to support why the government should allow abortion. K? Thanx.

[Ellie_Penguin]

"I never said abortion is safer than having a child. I simply stated a fact, that child birth is the closest to death a woman comes during her life."

 

 

Hmmm just because it is painful, doesn't mean that's the closest to death a woman will come during her life. Actually, that's NOTHING compared to what "closest to death" really is. When you give birth you can choose to use anesthesia which relieves a lot of the pain. Also, it really depends on how good of a pregnancy you had on whether or not the birth will have complications. And not every woman suffers A LOT of pain. The mom of the baby I babysit, didn't go through a lot of pain when she gave birth and just after 5 hours, she went back home and threw a pizza party with her newborn and family. And she lost half of her baby weight and still looks as she was before she even got pregnant.

[Mira]

Lol wow, it looks like you're starting to run out of ideas?

 

You say that I am taking your writing literally. OF COURSE I AM. What do you want me to do analyze it figuratively and read your mind and find out what you really wanted to say? Maybe just post more clearly instead of just saying I'm "twisting" your words. (You've used that same word way too many times by the way)

 

Again you said the same thing as you did in the above post in that you said you didnt post that childbirth was safer than abortion. If you scroll up and look what you posted, you shall see that you posted that childbirth is the closest a women gets to death. Now is it just me or is this saying that childbirth can very likely cause a women to die? closest to death? What else could it mean? That childbirth is perfectly safe and that a woman is in no danger? Therefore you are obviously saying that childbirth is the MOST dangerous because it is the CLOSEST a woman can get to death. This is what you posted so how can you deny it? If you worded it incorrectly than just say so instead of trying to back up something that your obviously wrong on.

 

Abortion= WAY MORE DANGEROUS THAN CHILDBIRTH. Done.

 

You also said that "My 'men' statement was that most people doing the debating on this issue are men. Most of the people who decide on issues like this are men." So you are saying that women have very little choice in this matter. Because MOST of the people debating on this issue are men and MOST of the people deciding are men. THE DEFINITION OF MOST. This is where you are wrong. Women probably voice their opinion as much as men if not even more than men on the topic of abortion and are a large part of the people who vote on abortion. How can you possibly know and even assume that men make MOST of the decision on abortion?

 

Finally, I belive I did not post "I support my view better than yours. neener neener neener". I posted "How about you stop acting so "childish" by trying to deny everything that you posted and stop accusing me of "twisting" your words just because I seem to be able to support my view better than yours..."

 

Now in your definition you are now acting "CHILDISH" and you are "TWISTING MY WORDS" by "LOOKING FURTHER THAN WHAT I SAID" (because did I put neener neener neener? No). Also you said I look at your posts literally. But now you said in your last paragraph I look further than what you said which means that I don't take your posts literally enough.

 

Seems like just a lot of plain contradictions in your posts. And don't even try to use me using "childish and twisting" against me because you are the one who first decided to post those words to describe me.

 

Now try to get off the topic of trying to deny what you obviously said and try to think of new reasons to support why the government should allow abortion. K? Thanx.

We didn't come here to start a war okay? Stop fighting. I find that childish.

[WEVIL]

We didn't come here to start a war okay? Stop fighting. I find that childish.

 

You already said that in your previous post and once was enough. And why do you quote my above text when your reply has absolutley nothing to do with it? How dare you call me childish when all you seem to be doing is saying the same thing over and over again with your whole "Stop trying to debate with Fuzio". All I'm trying to do is have a sensible debate and I don't know how you find that childish in anyway.

[Ellie_Penguin]

We're not starting a war. We're debating and all we're doing is support our points.

[Fuzio]

Okay, for those of you unaware; it is a well-known fact that for the mother, child birth is the closest she comes to death. For the mother, abortion is not more dangerous than child birth. I still don't see why this is even being discussed, what does it matter how safe it is? We should be debating rather it should be legal or not.

 

Now, if I have to explain this again, I'm sure I'll explode. Just because I said 'most' people who are discussing this topic are men does not mean women have little say in this. I'm questioning WHY are most of the people, in the public eye, discussing this issue men? Women should have the only say on this issue, in my opinion. Yes, ultimately men will play a factor in future decisions but this issue deals with women's rights. To me, it's like having a straight person make decisions on gay rights. Rather stupid.

 

When it comes to using the phrase 'twisting my words', do you expect me to only say it once? When I attempt to describe what you're doing, should I use different forms of describing it, that way I don't use the same explanation more than once? Don't see why it matters.

 

I think it's gotten a little out of hand.

 

And as proof to your twisting of my words. I never said the government should legalize abortion. Not once, I would love to see where you got that. What I DID say was that I am against abortion, but I feel the government has no right regulating rather a woman can have an abortion or not.

[Mira]

You already said that in your previous post and once was enough. And why do you quote my above text when your reply has absolutley nothing to do with it? How dare you call me childish when all you seem to be doing is saying the same thing over and over again with your whole "Stop trying to debate with Fuzio". All I'm trying to do is have a sensible debate and I don't know how you find that childish in anyway.

I never said that you were childish, I said that I find fighting childish.

 

And Penguin, I didn't say this was a war I said that I didn't want to start a war.

[WEVIL]

Okay, for those of you unaware; it is a well-known fact that for the mother, child birth is the closest she comes to death. For the mother, abortion is not more dangerous than child birth. I still don't see why this is even being discussed, what does it matter how safe it is? We should be debating rather it should be legal or not.

 

Now, if I have to explain this again, I'm sure I'll explode. Just because I said 'most' people who are discussing this topic are men does not mean women have little say in this. I'm questioning WHY are most of the people, in the public eye, discussing this issue men? Women should have the only say on this issue, in my opinion. Yes, ultimately men will play a factor in future decisions but this issue deals with women's rights. To me, it's like having a straight person make decisions on gay rights. Rather stupid.

 

When it comes to using the phrase 'twisting my words', do you expect me to only say it once? When I attempt to describe what you're doing, should I use different forms of describing it, that way I don't use the same explanation more than once? Don't see why it matters.

 

I think it's gotten a little out of hand.

 

And as proof to your twisting of my words. I never said the government should legalize abortion. Not once, I would love to see where you got that. What I DID say was that I am against abortion, but I feel the government has no right regulating rather a woman can have an abortion or not.

 

I'd love to hear where you got this so WELL-KNOWN FACT from. Idk how childbirth which occurs nearly every mintue in the world is somehow safer than abortion where, like I stated before, complicated and gruesome procedures are performed on the motehr to kill a child. Vacumming out the fetus, usign lethal chemicals, etc. etc. So how is it a WELL KNOW FACT that abortion is safer than childbirth?

 

Yes you are going to have to explain this again, now you are saying that only woman shoudl have the say on abortion. Let me show you how deluded a fact this is. If you ever go into a court case when a woman is a victim of a crime, do you see only women as the jury? No. You see a nearly equal amount of men and women as part of jury. If you had the jury al lcomposed of women, there would be a ridiculous bias toward the case and would be immediatley appealed. Same goes for abortion. You cant have only women deciding on the issue because that leaves out the opinion of the men who has a right to influence the decision whether his potential child should be born or not. Therefore, it is impossible to not let men have a say on abortion.

 

Yes I expect you to not use "twisting my words" because I obviously never do and whenever you try to show proof of me "twisting your words" IT NEVER WORKS.

 

Idk how you possibly have a point of view like this. You say that the government should NOT legalize abortion but a women still deserves to decide whether she should have an abortion or not? HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE? A COMPLETE PARADOX RIGHT THERE! The government should ban abortion but somehow still let women have abortion? I really think you need to clarify your point of view because you are just constantly contradicting yourself.

 

Therefore, I am not twisting your words because you seem to be the one twisting them around in your own mouth. Whenever I rebut something you are obviously trying to support, you say something completely different that contradicts your original point of view and then accuse me of "TWISTING YOUR WORDS". Find a view to support instead of pointing your finger at me just because you cant seem to stop contradciting yourself.

[Ellie_Penguin]

Okay so I did some research and found out that Abortion is actually more dangerous than childbirth. And also here's a fact: not every death from abortion is reported. Here are some websites of childbirth statistics, and a full list of everything that happens after abortion.

 

 

Childbirth statistics: http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/c/childbirth/deaths.htm

 

Abortion Website: http://www.afterabortion.org/

 

Now, if you don't want to read all of the sections. Just click on "List of Physical Complications from Abortion".

[WEVIL]

Death from abortion 4 times more likely than death from childbirth... There you go. End of story no way you can say childbirth is more dangerous than abortion. The list of complications is long and has diseases such as hissi cancer. Now how is childbirth mreo dangerous than that?

[Fuzio]

I'd love to hear where you got this so WELL-KNOWN FACT from. Idk how childbirth which occurs nearly every mintue in the world is somehow safer than abortion where, like I stated before, complicated and gruesome procedures are performed on the motehr to kill a child. Vacumming out the fetus, usign lethal chemicals, etc. etc. So how is it a WELL KNOW FACT that abortion is safer than childbirth?

 

Yes you are going to have to explain this again, now you are saying that only woman shoudl have the say on abortion. Let me show you how deluded a fact this is. If you ever go into a court case when a woman is a victim of a crime, do you see only women as the jury? No. You see a nearly equal amount of men and women as part of jury. If you had the jury al lcomposed of women, there would be a ridiculous bias toward the case and would be immediatley appealed. Same goes for abortion. You cant have only women deciding on the issue because that leaves out the opinion of the men who has a right to influence the decision whether his potential child should be born or not. Therefore, it is impossible to not let men have a say on abortion.

 

Yes I expect you to not use "twisting my words" because I obviously never do and whenever you try to show proof of me "twisting your words" IT NEVER WORKS.

 

Idk how you possibly have a point of view like this. You say that the government should NOT legalize abortion but a women still deserves to decide whether she should have an abortion or not? HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE? A COMPLETE PARADOX RIGHT THERE! The government should ban abortion but somehow still let women have abortion? I really think you need to clarify your point of view because you are just constantly contradicting yourself.

 

Therefore, I am not twisting your words because you seem to be the one twisting them around in your own mouth. Whenever I rebut something you are obviously trying to support, you say something completely different that contradicts your original point of view and then accuse me of "TWISTING YOUR WORDS". Find a view to support instead of pointing your finger at me just because you cant seem to stop contradciting yourself.

 

I never said what government should do. I never said they should legalize it or ban it, I don't think they have a right to regulate it. That's my opinion.

 

Do I think women should have abortions? No.

 

How is that a 'paradox'?

 

Also, a crime where the victim is a female is far different than making a law which affects every woman in the country. The law would ONLY apply to women, so I feel women should have most of the say in whatever law is put into place.

 

If I ever actually said 'men should have no say what-so-ever in this matter'...well, I lied. lol. They should have 'some' say but I think the majority of the decision should be made by females. It is a law that affects them and only them.

 

Yes, it indirectly affects husbands and families but you know what I mean.

 

And one of those websites is an anti-abortion website. So what the hell do you think it's going to say? Lol - That's like claiming gays are immoral and will burn in hell and linking to godhatesfags.com as proof.

 

I have always been told, and maybe it's a myth but I've even heard it on those television shows showing mothers giving birth, that a natural childbirth is the closest a woman comes to death in her life.

 

I still don't see what that has to do with anything anyways, rather it is or not. We should be debating rather it should be legal.

[Empress Keiko]

I think that abortion is a perfectly good thing.

 

First of all, if a women has an...affair....and she becomes pregnant, she should have the choice of having an abortion.

 

Second of all, already said, giving birth is extremely deadly. If a woman doesn't want to go through that, an abortion is a good choice.

[Ellie_Penguin]

You can't deny that the website is telling it the way it is. What more proof do you want? Do YOU have anything that says abortions are less dangerous, or any website that offers proof that it isn't? Those medical terms are not made up and they are based on all of the cases they have seen. And there's a different between a hate website and a debate website. A hate website will be all about bashing and saying very hateful things. Now, that anti-abortion website is based on REAL research. They're not saying "omg pro-abortionists are the worst thing in the world. Like omg abortion is bad because I say it so."

[Fuzio]

"You can't deny that the website is telling it the way it is."

-----

Uhm, it's an anti-abortion website. Thus their research will be biased.

 

If you go to a democratic website and a republican website, I guarantee you if you find the same 'statistics' on their websites, the numbers will be different. Why? Bias. (;

 

I'm still not 100% saying one is safer than the other. I don't care which is safer, it doesn't matter. We should be debating if it should be legalized. Which is why I don't understand the 'argument'. I agree women should not have abortions. Just because I don't think the government has a right to regulate it doesn't mean I think it should be legal.

[WEVIL]

I swear you people are fools. Idk how you possibly say we should not be debating whether abortion is safe or not. I think determining whether a procedure has a high chance of KILLING you , is very important in deciding whther we should legalize it or not. I swear how else do you possibly defend a viewpoint?

 

You think the website's biased? Find a website that says a women has a higher chance of dying from childbirth than abortion. Plz find a credible webstie that states that. K? THANX. Abortion is not safer than childbirth so abortion should be banned.

 

If a women has an affair? HOW CAN YOU POSSIBLY SUPPORT THAT SHE HAS AN ABORTION? Now your just using abortion as a birth control so that people don't have to take responsibility for their actions and its consequence. A women has an affair or unsafe sex and she gets pregnant. She just turns to abortion and now has a new form of birth control so she doesn't have to worry about that stupid decision she made and just killed a baby. Nice taking responsibility.

 

That makes no sense Fuzio. How about you reread your post? How do you possibly say that the government should not be allowed to regulate abortion BUT STILL SAY it should not be LEGAL? THAT MEANS THE GOVERNMENT IS REGULATING ABORTION FOR WOMEN. DO YOU UNDERSTAND ENGLISH? Restate your point of view so it actually makes sense instead of contradicting yourself.

[Ellie_Penguin]

Besides, I'm pretty sure they teach about abortion and its risks in every high school. I've also learned from those classes that the more abortions you have, the less likely you will be able to conceive a child later on. Therefore, if you have an abortion right now, but later you want to have a child, it is going to be a little harder for you to conceive.

 

"You can't deny that the website is telling it the way it is."

-----

Uhm, it's an anti-abortion website. Thus their research will be biased.

 

If you go to a democratic website and a republican website, I guarantee you if you find the same 'statistics' on their websites, the numbers will be different. Why? Bias. (;

 

I'm still not 100% saying one is safer than the other. I don't care which is safer, it doesn't matter. We should be debating if it should be legalized. Which is why I don't understand the 'argument'. I agree women should not have abortions. Just because I don't think the government has a right to regulate it doesn't mean I think it should be legal.

 

Okay, tell me why each point made on that website is biased? So, they just came up with everything because they're against abortion? That's ridiculous. When you have a point, you do whatever you have to do to support it and that's what that website did. It gathered up all of the information they could to support their point of view on why abortion is wrong. Just accept that those are TRUE facts. Like WEVIL said, if you can find a pro-abortion website where they discuss why is it safer than childbirth, please I would like to see so I can compare them both. Yes, the numbers will be different because they do a different type of research (that involves different numbers of people). Remember that not every abortion death is reported so those numbers are probably lower than they should be. Please, instead of saying "bias" provide us solid proof (ie. websites) to support your point.

[Mira]

I swear you people are fools.

 

You think the website's biased? Find a website that says a women has a higher chance of dying from childbirth than abortion. Plz find a credible webstie that states that. K? THANX. Abortion is not safer than childbirth so abortion should be banned.

You're the fool. You don't need a website to know that women have a better chance of dying during childbirth than men!

[WEVIL]

You're the fool. You don't need a website to know that women have a better chance of dying during childbirth than men!

 

That makes no sense we never said women dont have a higher chance of dying than a man in childbirth. A man doesnt even go throguh childbirth... Wow. We just said a women has a hgiher chance of dying fro mabortion and not childbirth.

[Ellie_Penguin]

You're the fool. You don't need a website to know that women have a better chance of dying during childbirth than men!

 

Do you even know what you are talking about? Anyways, the website shows statistics based on medical research. Please instead of talking nonsense, support your point. Do YOU have a website that says otherwise? Please provide it. You DO need scientific tests to prove that something is wrong or to make statistics. So medical exams are just made up? So that website for example, is just making all of those things up because they are against abortion? It is actually the opposite. They are against abortion because of those terms!

 

Now, if you are against abortion because you think it is safer than childbirth, then that's your own problem. But if you deny facts, then...

[Mira]

That makes no sense we never said women dont have a higher chance of dying than a man in childbirth. A man doesnt even go throguh childbirth... Wow. We just said a women has a hgiher chance of dying fro mabortion and not childbirth.

Well there are two genders of humans. Female and male. So if someone is female, then the other gender must be male.

[WEVIL]

Well there are two genders of humans. Female and male. So if someone is female, then the other gender must be male.

 

I refuse to argue with you anymore because its painfully obvious you are just saying things from out of thin air.

[Ellie_Penguin]

Well, I guess until proven otherwise (i.e. with PROOF). Abortion is more dangerous than childbirth according to statistics and medical tests (don't forget that not every death from abortion is reported).

[Mira]

I refuse to argue with you anymore because its painfully obvious you are just saying things from out of thin air.

You are like a modrn day Scrooge. It's Christmas Eve and you're still insulting me.