Gay Marriage

[livvy]

Ha, well the "instinctual law" I was referring to was the base, animalistic sex-drive, which (in the animal world, anyway) requires a male and a female. Humans, on the other hand, are intellectually above animals (at least, they say we are, but sometimes I'm not so sure...) and therefore should be above the base sex-drive as well, and should also be capable of choosing for ourselves what's morally right and wrong. I don't have anything against homosexual relationships; I just don't fully understand them. As for kissing and cuddling, I tend to look down on (or rather, look away from) any kissing/cuddling in public between any combination of gender, race, age, ethnicity, whatever. It's just not something I really want to see. Some of my acquaintences will make particular jokes when they see gays holding hands or something, but I find something as innocent as holding hands to be just as acceptable as any "normal" couple holding hands, and certainly not deserving of childish remarks. Of course, they only do it because they've been taught to do so by the rest of society, and I'm afraid I must agree that on certain matters, human intelligence does regress a few hundred years.

 

We can't judge whether hetero- or homosexual relationships are morally right for a certain person; it's their decision, and they have the right to make it. And if we can't judge that it's morally wrong, then we have no basis to say that it's legally wrong.

 

~ Livvy

[Queen Diva]

It's ok Livvy, I was being sarcastic :D

 

No harm no foul!

 

I agree with you.. for all it's worth.

 

Just wish the rest of the world would be so understanding!

[Shane for Wax]

Christ wasn’t a hater. If you don’t think any of my other arguments hold any water I have saved the best for last. Christ had a very distinct answer to sin, and regardless of if you think that homosexuality is a choice or if you’re born a homosexual, Christ’s answer is the same. It is His purview to evaluate and punish sinful behavior — and it is our purview to love one another and do our best to live together in a way that honors what He has done for us. If you are a Christian and reading this, then please remember the woman who was to be stoned. Christ advised others to not pick up stones and then didn’t even pick one up Himself, but chose instead to forgive. That is a powerful message for all of us.

 

Its all hypocrisy in the long run. Just remember that various religious groups have tried to prove that homosexuality is a transmittable disease. If that was so, then everyone whose ever ridden the NY Subway, or flown on an airplane is now a homosexual…this includes most of those religious folks…but of course G*d protects them and not the rest of us…because we’re unworthy or something. More and more this sound like a massive mental issue…can we check the drinking water now?

[livvy]

Yes, because we are Christian, He puts a magical veil around us and protects us from the evils of homosexuality. *flat stare* Forgive my sarcasm. It's late where I am.

 

Anywho, I was unaware that homosexuality was considered to be transmittable. I find that somewhat amusing, though the fact that it's considered a disease is more disturbing than amusing. Your reference to the stoning is apt: most of the people who condemn homosexuality are looked down on for something themselves. And consequently, they have no right to judge. Even those who aren't Christian should know how to forgive. Those in America should know that - regardless of gender, race, age, religion - we are given freedom of the pursuit of happiness as long as it doesn't infringe on another person's freedom. I don't see how homosexuality infringes on my freedom or anyone else's freedom, so the gays have a right to their choice.

 

(Sorry if my argument is rather incoherent. As I said earlier, it's late here. =/ )

 

~ Livvy

[Shane for Wax]

I only mentioned what I did because I have MET people who do believe that homosexuality is a transmittable disease, of which they are protected from because they believe in God. Apparently we are all forgetting about the gay ministers that have popped up every now and then? But the rest of my argument is sound. Judge not lest ye be judged yerself, is this not so? As I have said time and again in similar arguments, my being bisexual does not infringe on your freedoms, now does it? I'm not DOING anything to you. I have a right to happiness just as much as you do. And my happiness involves being able to hold my girlfriend's hand in public, or kissing her in public, like you heterosexuals do. If you don't like it, you don't have to look.

 

*glances down at her signature* Support marriage equality. Say no to hate.

[ibeagreenbean]

Personally, I really like this debate topic.

 

You get both sides, you know?

 

But I have to admit, though, I do believe that the seperation of church and state applies here and gay people should be allowed to marry because it really isn't any concern of anyone else's. Though, I do think the ceremony should be held in a different way because the weddings they have are usually based around christianity...

 

I dunno. Hopefully that didn't come out rude or anything...

 

But... I mean... I'm gay, and I wanna get married someday, too. Why should it matter if it's to a woman? :]

[Shane for Wax]

Christians aren't the only ones to have a marriage ceremony. If I believed in marriage, and were to be married, I'd have a Pagan ceremony.

[ibeagreenbean]

I know, that's why I said usually. :]

 

Well, I probably should have rephrased that...

 

The way that weddings are usually thought of here is a christian one. (Usually)

 

(The previous post was at like three in the morning going on my second day without sleep. Ha.)

[Shane for Wax]

My mom and dad were married by a justice of the peace. :D

[YahuhItsJake]

I Think Gay Marriage Should Be Accepted By The Public.

There Are Lots Of Gays/Bisexuals In My School And I Get On With Them Really Well.

They Dont Cause A Threat To Me Or Make Me Feel Uncomfortable... :)

[AntiGravityAzn]

I don't see why gay people shouldn't have a right to be married. As a straight Christian female, I see no problem with two gay people getting married. Everyone is so worried about the sanctity of marriage, but there are people getting married at 2am in Las Vegas after knowing each other for 3 days. There are celebrities getting married and divorced faster than you have to refuel your car...so I'm pretty sure "the sanctity of marriage" is not a valid point at all.

 

As far as children being raised in a "gay" environment, I am adopted from South Korea. I was raised by a bipolar mother and an alcoholic/drug addicted father. To be quite honest, I would have rather been adopted by two, level-headed, responsible homosexual parents than a heterosexual couple who had NO business raising a child. Besides, there are too many homeless children out there and the orphanages are suffering and I think the amount of gay couples adopting children would at least help that situation, even by a little.

 

I would also take a look at this website:

 

Ten Reasons Why Gay Marriage is Un-American

http://bw.org/gay-marriage.html

 

It's a bitter and sarcastic take on this whole thing, but in all sincerity, it hits the nail right on the head.

[Shane for Wax]

I insist on everyone to read any psychology book. There is NO substantial evidence that children raised in a homosexual home come out to be weird/gay themselves/etc., In essence I agree with the person above me. lol

[M!!]

I insist on everyone to read any psychology book. There is NO substantial evidence that children raised in a homosexual home come out to be weird/gay themselves/etc., In essence I agree with the person above me. lol

*applauds*

 

I absolutely loathe hearing people say that. And if that were the case, then why aren't straight people raising only straight children? The arguments people make sometimes are really disgusting and repetitive. The things that the world says against homosexuals were once said against people of color - and by this I do not only mean those of the African diaspora - slaves, and women.

[bunnyinsane]

Didn't read the whole thread BUT...

 

If we outlaw gay marriage, we should outlaw shell-fish too. Because that was in the bible. And stone our wives and children. Because that was in the bible too.

 

Personally I believe we should get rid of the outdated institution of marriage and have civil union for everyone. A bit unromantic, but marriage is strongly tied to religion and so I can't say I agree with it.

[CasiCane.]

I started reading this thread like, a long time ago and didn't read all the responses, too much @__@ I can't even remember if I already posted my views. If so, sorry :D

 

I'm bisexual, and have very strong views on Gay Marriage. I think that if two people love eachother, and want to be together, they should have the right. The government puts out all this bs about they just want to get married for money and stuff, and yeah, that might be the case sometimes, but not always. Some gays truly do love eachother, and they deserve to have the same right as straights.

 

Furthermore, I believe you are born gay. They did some studies and the brain of a gay boy and straight women were similar, where as a gay girl and straight mans were similar. Yes, other things may influence your orientation, but in the end, you were always the way you are, whether you admit it or not.

 

I guess I'm partially so into this topic because some people I really care about have been hurt just for being themselves. My boyfriend's teacher slammed him against the wall and punched him in the face, calling him a "useless gay **** that will go nowhere sucking **** all his life." Another friend had some kids trash his mailbox, horse fence, and spread garbage all through his yard.

 

People in today's society are sick and immature. But if you are against gay marriage and stuff, that's fine, I have homophobe friends, it's just the way they were brought up. I won't think any less of you ^___^

 

Unless, of course, your "explanation" is some mindless babbling about how it's just gross and wrong =_= So is half the other things you see in today's world, but hey, it's still happening.

[Mimii]

I'm not in here to debate but I am going to say that I am all for gay marriages and have been a bridesmaid for a gay couple even. Most of my friends are gay, I love them to bits. I just want to see them happy. I like to see people happy!

[livvy]

Good for you! And I agree. The term "gay" originally meant happy. If they're happy together, what right do we have to take away that happiness?

[Jejune]

That is a matter of opinion - it is still being debate whether or not it is a choice to be gay. JMO...

Hmm, it's too hard to say if someone is born gay. But who would choose it for the sake of it? Who would choose to be something that gets them disowned by their parents, ridiculed by old friends and denied basic rights? Besides, you can't usually decide who you fall in love with, and you can't just fall in love with someone of the same gender because you "chose" to be gay...

 

Also can homosexuality be considered unnatural if the animal kingdom engages in it quite often? Hm hm!

[qtpie6108]

I don't see how it matters if its a choice or not, why should people be judged on who they like. We're all human, it shouldn't matter if a girl wants to be with another girl (guy with guy as well), its there choice and I see no reason why they shouldn't be allowed to document that with marriage.

New research is saying there is a gene that they think may lead to someone being gay (we talked about it in my psychology class) but even if its not a biological thing, maybe a nurturing or psychological thing it shouldn't matter. Love is Love, at least thats how I see it :)

[Natalie - Fallen Daydreams]

Hmm, it's too hard to say if someone is born gay. But who would choose it for the sake of it? Who would choose to be something that gets them disowned by their parents, ridiculed by old friends and denied basic rights? Besides, you can't usually decide who you fall in love with, and you can't just fall in love with someone of the same gender because you "chose" to be gay...

 

Also can homosexuality be considered unnatural if the animal kingdom engages in it quite often? Hm hm!

I don't believe that anyone can be born gay, but I do believe some people can't help but turn gay. Like you said, you can't help who you fall in love with. It's usually based on the things the person has gone through.

[lazycrazykitten]

This is something my friend sent me in an email a while back and I thought it made a rather good point.

 

10 Reasons to Oppose Gay Marriage

 

 

1) Being gay is not natural. Real Americans always reject unnatural things

like eyeglasses, polyester, liposuction, and air conditioning.

 

2) Gay marriage will encourage people to be gay, in the same way that

hanging around tall people will make you tall.

 

3) Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy

behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because a dog has legal

standing and can sign a marriage contract.

 

4) Straight marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all:

women are still property, blacks still can't marry whites, and divorce is

still illegal.

 

5) Straight marriage will be less meaningful if gay marriage were allowed;

the sanctity of Britney Spears' 55-hour just-for-fun marriage would be

destroyed.

 

6) Straight marriages are valid because they produce children. Gay couples,

infertile couples, and old people shouldn't be allowed to marry because our

orphanages aren't full yet, and the world needs more children.

 

7) Obviously, gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents

only raise straight children.

 

8) Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the

values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we

have only one religion in America.

 

9) Children can never succeed without both a male and a female role model

at home. That's why we as a society expressly forbid single parents to

raise children.

 

10) Gay marriage will change the foundation of society; we could never

adapt to new social norms. Just like we haven't adapted to cars, the

service-sector economy, or longer life spans.

 

Obviously I'm for gay marriage, though I am straight. There is absolutely no reason I can think of to ban two people from marrying one another.

[Ruto]

I question the validity of your friend's email, because nearly everything I read is completely false.

 

1. Firstly, what does being an American have to do with rejecting unnatural things? I'm sure there are other people of other countries that reject that kind of stuff.

Second, if people naturally reject the things listed, then why do so many people accept them into their lives, anyway? And airconditioning? Eyeglasses? Liposuction? Some of these things are required to help people live better lives. If you live somewhere hot like Arizona or Texas, then air conditioning is pretty much a necessity. If you have poor vision, you cannot drive on the roads without being a hazard to others, so eyeglasses or contacts are necessary there if you want to continue driving. If you're severly overweight and can't excersize the weight off, liposuction may be your only option to save yourself from having a heart attack or heart failure in the near future, and it can expand your lifespan.

 

2. Seeing a gay couple will not make someone think, "Oh, they're gay, I should be gay, too." People make their own choices in life. They know who they want to be with, and just because they see a gay couple does not mean that they themselves will be gay. And where did the fact that hanging around tall people makes you tall come from? That has absolutely no effect on how fast your body grows.

 

3. That's just plain untrue. Dogs are animals. They do not have the same standing as humans.

 

4. True that straight marriage has been around for a while, but the rest of that is just plain rude. Women are not property, and I'd like to slap the person that says they are. Blacks can marry whites, just look at Gary Coleman and Shannon Price. Divorce is not illegal; my parents divorced their own partners before finding each other, just to prove that.

 

5. For those who embrace straight marriage, it will be no less meaningful just because gay marriage exists. If those people feel comfortable with the choice they made, then it will be meaninful to them. And I haven't heard about the Brittney Spears thing, so you'll have to fill me in on that.

 

6. You want orphanages to be full? You know that means there will be more orphaned and homeless children, right? If anything, they should be more empty. Even though gay couples can't produce children, they can adopt if they really want children, thus giving one more child a home of their own. And the world doesn't necessarily need more children; just look at China. Their population is so enourmous that they have to limit the amount of children each couple has: one boy and one girl max. If they have any more, they have to pay a fine.

 

7. Untrue. Gay parents can raise straight children, and straight parents can raise gay children. While the environment they grew up in has a big effect on who the kids marry later in life, it does not totally control what they will do as an adult. It all depends on the child and who they find that they love.

 

8. It depends on which religion you address whether or not gay marriage is supported. While Christianity does not support gay marriage, atheists are not bound by this law. They have their own morals, and if they believe gay marriage is right, then so be it. And there is more than one religion in America; Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism, they all have their own beliefs. Christianity is just the dominating percentage in the U.S., which may be bumped down to 2nd place if the Islamic religion continues to grow at the current rate.

 

9. Where is the validity in this? What studies prove this? I have tons of friends who only have a single parent, and they are still successful. The same goes for many children across the U.S. How are we forbidding a single parent to raise children? And why would we do that in the first place? Since the article I read doesn't allow me to copy and past excerpts, I suggest you visit this website and read this essay.

 

10. We can never adapt to social norms? Who said that? In our society now, we pretty much are required to adapt to new ideas, or else you cannot effeciently deal with the people at your job, or you can't fit in to regular society. I'm not saying you have to stick with what the ideas say, but it's better to at least listen to the idea and use your own judgement rather than simply saying, "I don't accept that and I don't want to hear your reasons".

 

And this...I don't even know what to say about this. We can't adapt to cars? Have you seen the streets lately? When you're an adult and you live too far away from work to walk or ride a bike, having a car is pretty much a necessity if you want to get anywhere. Even if you can't use a car where you live, you can always take the bus or subway, another form of motorized transportation.

 

And I don't think people are rejecting the idea of longer lifespans. We have people making the local news when they turn 100, or any age after that. It just means that our medical technology is becoming better and helping people live their lives to the fullest, for as long as they want or are able to.

 

 

In short, it seems like that whole email pretty much just made up some of its points.

[Macabre]

In short, it seems like that whole email pretty much just made up some of its points.

 

That is the whole point...it's a joke.

[Unstream]

Heh heh, that's a great email.

It basically just attacked every stand point against gay marriage.

Genius!

[StuckInSanity]

Ha ha, that email cracked me up. :laughingsmiley:

 

I haven't read this entire topic, and while this is something I could rant about for a while (this was one of our writing assignments this year in English too, so I think I've still got an entire essay on why I support gay marriage somewhere on my computer), I'm pretty sure everything I could say has already been discussed, leaving me with nothing more to contribute other than to say I agree with you, Lazycrazykitten - while I'm straight, I can see absolutely no reason why two people shouldn't be allowed to marry each other, just because they're the same gender.