How to deal with overly-religious friends?

[~Xandria]

Hi all. I've been having some recent troubles lately regarding a childhood friend of mine. I love her to death and we have been friends since the 3rd grade. Lately though, I've noticed her being more and more condesending about my beliefs (which are totally opposite of hers.)

 

To start off: I do not consider myself an atheist persay. I know deep down I am a very spiritual person but I do not believe in there being one 'entity' like God nor heaven/hell. My spirituality mostly comes from nature. I also enjoy studying many different ancient beliefs like paganism/buddhism. I do not claim a religion at this present time, nor do I know if I ever will. But I am very connected to mother earth and protecting our planet, etc. With that being said, I am also a liberal who is supportive of the gay rights movement, women's rights, and keeping our planet/animals/forests safe and clean.

 

My friend on the other hand is a Christian who goes to church every Sunday and Wensday. She is also a youth pastor there. She is also a Republican who is completely against gay marriage. (Note - I'm not gay, but I do feel very strongly for these individuals and the way they are treated - especially in the name of religion) Getting off topic, sorry.

 

At first my religion was not a big deal to her... but I find myself getting increasingly frustrated at these 'attempts' to convert me. She knows this will never happen, I've made that pretty clear. She still continues to ask me to go to church with her though. Hanging out with her has become more and more difficult because she is always talking about god and her church. (I know this probably sounds rude, please note I do not have a problem with Christians) I'm just afraid our friendship is suffering and that she is never going to accept me the way I am. I feel like no matter what I do she is always going to look at me like I'm going to burn in the pits of hell one day. I know she means well, I guess. I know she honestly thinks I'm going to hell if I don't change my ways.

 

I know this is getting a bit long so I'm going to wrap it up. I just wanted to rant because I'm frustrated, thinking I'm going to lose my friendship with her over this. Things weren't this bad (say 3 months back) it has just recently gotten worse. Now the only thing she talks about is bible scriptures and god and church. It seems she never talks about anything else anymore. I am just forced to sit there and nod (even though inside I want to blow up at her!). I mean - she doesn't see me talking about evolution, gay marriage, and Obama all the time!

 

Any advice would be appreciated. Thank you if you took the time to read this!

[Kaana]

1. How long has your friend been a pastor for? From my experiences in church, it seems like it is incredibly intimidating to step up to the role of pastor, and she may be feeling insecure in her relationship with God. In an attempt to become what she might feel she "has to be", she might be over doing the bible verses and talking about church, as well as to reassure herself that she's close enough to God.

 

2. Have you ever actually gone to her church? I'm not suggesting you go regularly, but certainly if you've gone at least once, you can tell her that, no, it is not in fact your thing, you've been, you know.

 

3. Argue with her. You sound like you're letting yourself be a bit of a door mat in order to not hurt her feelings. It's not healthy for your relationship.

[karmacow]

Maybe suggest other topics to talk about, other than god or the bible? Friendships require respect both ways, so she has to respect your views like you respect hers. No matter how wrong both of you think the other is.

I commend you for wanting to hold on to your friendship. I know I would have a hard time if I were in your shoes.

[passiflora]

Have you told her that it bothers you? I can't tell by your post if you have - but maybe let her know what your beliefs are and why they're important to you, tell her that you respect her beliefs too, then agree to disagree. Ask if you can talk about something else.

 

 

I'm not sure if I would suggest arguing because I'm not sure it's easy to sway someone that firmly planted in what they believe, but sometimes it makes a difference to someone if you point out something like "I try my best to be a good person, why would God punish me for that?" It might make her reevaluate things or at least tone them down a bit.

 

 

It might also be worthwhile to look up resources that might change her views while still having a religious basis. For example, some people don't believe the bible condemns homosexuality at all. Even if that doesn't work, you could remind her that homosexuality is mentioned maybe six or seven times (may be worthwhile to find the actual number) while 'love', or 'loving thy neighbour', etc., is mentioned countless times. If you want to talk about the planet, maybe find some Bible verses where God calls people to protect the planet. It might not tone down the God-talk, but it could at least align your views and make it easier to listen to. :)

[Zombiiesque]

I've been in your shoes, and it's hard. I'm totally liberal and I call myself Pagan, because that's really the easiest way to define it - I believe in both a God and a Goddess, although I don't adhere strictly to any one doctrine. I found out early on that organized Christian religion wasn't for me, although I tried because it seemed to be what society wanted from me - I wasn't comfortable at all. I didn't believe. It's a long story and if you'd like, we can talk more about it via PM, but basically, I found my own way through an extensive amount of reading and soul searching. I actually got into an in depth conversation once with a friend of ours about my beliefs, and the man was very Christian and strict (for himself), but once we talked, he sat back and looked at me and told me that he could totally understand and respect my beliefs. That was a very nice conversation to have, and I wish all friends could be that open. Honestly, I've actually had to walk away from friendships because of this - and I didn't want to make that choice, but they just couldn't respect my viewpoint and stop cramming theirs down my throat. Really, that's a tough way to put it but that's how I felt. I can respect your viewpoint, and I won't talk down to you about it, so why can't you do the same for me? But I've also had friends that have realized that I'm not going to change, and they've come to accept it. I'm pretty outspoken about my beliefs if prodded, though.

[Rebecca~]

Maybe suggest other topics to talk about, other than god or the bible? Friendships require respect both ways, so she has to respect your views like you respect hers. No matter how wrong both of you think the other is.

I commend you for wanting to hold on to your friendship. I know I would have a hard time if I were in your shoes.

This. And I was really struck by her trying to convert you- doing that all the time, even though you've said that really isn't your thing, kind of shows a lack of respect for you. It might be hard, but you should kind of sit her down, say that you love her as a friend, but that you have different beliefs, and you don't appreciate her trying to convert you, and showing a lack of respect for the things that you believe in and think are right. Point out that you don't try to do the same to her, and you would like the same curtosy. After that, you can try to just change the topic whenever something comes up that you have very different beliefs on- while having debates can be fun, they can also become exhausting, and they don't make for a really tight friendship- you know, the arguing and taking down of beliefs every time you see each other.

[~Xandria]

Thanks so much everyone for your advice. I haven't sat her down to talk about it because I don't want to upset her. Maybe I am being a bit of a pushover though, idk. I just don't wanna step on any toes. I'm probably going to wind up doing so anyways though, it seems I won't have much of a choice if we are going to remain friends. It's especially difficult when we go and hang out with all her friends from church. -_- Oh and to answer the above question, I have gone to her church before. I most certainly didn't like it at all. The things they were saying in there were so flat out disrespectful towards gays. (I believe I caved and went with her right around the time the whole chick-fila thing was going on) so - I assume that's why that was the topic of the day.

 

*sighs* It really is hard being friends with someone who lives a completely different life than you. Things were MUCH easier when we were kids. It's terrible that politics and religion has to bring people apart... but that's a discussion for another topic on here. xD

 

Thank you everyone. I really really loved your reply Zombiessque. I would most certainly love to talk more about it. ^^

[lindorie]

I myself have a friend who is overly religious and quite obnoxious about it, she has tried to get me to believe in her religion, and I point blank had to tell her I wasn't interested. However, now she isn't taking her own advice, but that's another story. I myself am a combination between christian, pagan, and catholic. I strongly believe that there is a God figure out there, I'm just not sure how many or who. I may be a christian and strongly follow christian beliefs but I do support gay marriage, and gay rights as well as the rights of immigrants. I have to say dealing with an overly religious friend is tough but I've always just been honest with my friend and said to her, 'Your religion is yours, and mine is mine, let's leave it at that.' My friend has always been supportive of me through everything despite our religious differences, so I guess my situation is different, but all I can think to say is just be honest with how you are feeling about it and if they don't like what you have to say then maybe they weren't the friend you needed.

[AngelBones]

Ahh, I know how you feel very well. In my group of friends we have someone who seems similar to your friend, and so maybe I can give some advice.

 

First of all, definitely try to save your friendship. It seems like you guys have known each other for a while, so losing that over something which will always be argued seems unfair to the both of you.

Now I think that "prevention" will no longer help you. Usually for people who just start arguing about religion, avoiding the topic will often prevent fights. But this could still help you in the future. So just try to stay away from anything that could lead to you two arguing. Change the topic, or don't start the conversation at all. Now sometimes yes, it's hard because the person may make a comment directly challenging what you believe but it's easier to leave it than start having a go back at her.

Secondly, I think the best thing for the two of you right now is to confront her. I know you've said you don't want to, but if you don't stand your ground then you will in fact get pushed around by her, which seems rather unfair. You don't necessarily have to try and make her believe all that you do. Just let her know what your opinions are, and the fact that they are rather different to her own, but that that doesn't mean that the two of you can't be friends. Let her know that you do still consider her a very important person, and agree on a way to avoid getting into religious debates so that the both of you can peacefully coincide.

Now unfortunately this may not work. And if so, then it's time to cut ties. Yes I know that seems rather harsh, but as much as we'd lie to believe otherwise, people don't tend to change. And so, if she can't agree to compromise with you, she never will, and she'll continue to push you around. I think that no matter now good a friend she used to be to you, putting up with a problem so sever isn't worth it, especially if it's getting worse.

 

So that's what I reckon :). I hope it helped, and I hope the best for the both of you, especially around the Christmas season :). Good luck!

[gingerew]

Everyone has basically said what I would say: try to talk to her about it, explain that you respect her beliefs and she should respect yours. Hopefully you can have a friendship without fighting about religion, especially with her trying to "convert" you. Just wanted to chime in with my two cents and also commend you for being such a great friend that you are working hard to maintain a friendship even through tough times :)

[~Xandria]

Ahh, I know how you feel very well. In my group of friends we have someone who seems similar to your friend, and so maybe I can give some advice.

 

First of all, definitely try to save your friendship. It seems like you guys have known each other for a while, so losing that over something which will always be argued seems unfair to the both of you.

Now I think that "prevention" will no longer help you. Usually for people who just start arguing about religion, avoiding the topic will often prevent fights. But this could still help you in the future. So just try to stay away from anything that could lead to you two arguing. Change the topic, or don't start the conversation at all. Now sometimes yes, it's hard because the person may make a comment directly challenging what you believe but it's easier to leave it than start having a go back at her.

Secondly, I think the best thing for the two of you right now is to confront her. I know you've said you don't want to, but if you don't stand your ground then you will in fact get pushed around by her, which seems rather unfair. You don't necessarily have to try and make her believe all that you do. Just let her know what your opinions are, and the fact that they are rather different to her own, but that that doesn't mean that the two of you can't be friends. Let her know that you do still consider her a very important person, and agree on a way to avoid getting into religious debates so that the both of you can peacefully coincide.

Now unfortunately this may not work. And if so, then it's time to cut ties. Yes I know that seems rather harsh, but as much as we'd lie to believe otherwise, people don't tend to change. And so, if she can't agree to compromise with you, she never will, and she'll continue to push you around. I think that no matter now good a friend she used to be to you, putting up with a problem so sever isn't worth it, especially if it's getting worse.

 

So that's what I reckon :). I hope it helped, and I hope the best for the both of you, especially around the Christmas season :). Good luck!

Thanks so much for the thoughtful reply! I really appreciate it. Since I posted this I have talked with her, things have gotten a lot better than they were. I mean - A LOT. I think it just took me trying to explain why I have the beliefs I do, because before I don't think she really understood it.

 

But yeah. Our relationship is healthy now and I'm hoping it will continue to be :)

 

Thank you everyone for all the great advice!

[Rebecca~]

Thanks so much for the thoughtful reply! I really appreciate it. Since I posted this I have talked with her, things have gotten a lot better than they were. I mean - A LOT. I think it just took me trying to explain why I have the beliefs I do, because before I don't think she really understood it.

 

But yeah. Our relationship is healthy now and I'm hoping it will continue to be :)

 

Thank you everyone for all the great advice!

Yay, I'm so glad to hear that things are so much better now. :D

[lilshadowdweller]

I need to say something:

 

Your patience is commendable.

 

You have displayed a perspective upon which we should all obtain. Ie; your ability to see that she means well, even if she's forcing her religious views on you. You're setting an example for her. And yes, she's entitled to her beliefs, and her beliefs states that she can "save" people by converting them. But deep down, I doubt she really thinks you're going to Hell. Even when I was religious, I fought with that belief.

 

For her, it's difficult. She's surrounded by a religious community which will restrict her mind significantly. While the homosexual marriage issue isn't actually that big of an issue, I guarantee that her Church makes it so.

 

You won't be able to change her just as much as she won't be able to change you. In fact, the more hostile to become with her the more she'll respond in kind. To some religious people, a world without God simply cannot exist and isn't plausible. It's her lifestyle and it'll be difficult if not impossible for her to change.

 

But understand that you don't need to set aside your views, either.

 

You love her as a friend. That's what's important.

 

Going to Church wouldn't be so bad though, however, she may think it'll convert you and be surprised if it doesn't. Also, make sure she doesn't get others involved!

 

Anyway, yes, you're definitely a very opened minded person!!! Not conceited in the least and very patient.

[AngelBones]

Thanks so much for the thoughtful reply! I really appreciate it. Since I posted this I have talked with her, things have gotten a lot better than they were. I mean - A LOT. I think it just took me trying to explain why I have the beliefs I do, because before I don't think she really understood it.

 

But yeah. Our relationship is healthy now and I'm hoping it will continue to be :)

 

Thank you everyone for all the great advice!

Nawww xx!! I'm so glad :3. I always try, especially when I've been in nearly identical situations! AND YAY!!!! It's so great that you guys have sorted things out! Talking it out always seems to help, just in general. Well, most of the time ;P. But yeah, I wish you guys all the best with your newly mended friendship :D. Oh and Happy Holidays again! You know, that's if the world doesn't end ;D.

[Aloriality]

I would love, if I may, to rant myself, in this thread, same topic.

 

growing up, my only friend was Nicole, she taught me how to use my imagination, and well, in jr.high, when I was with her, she made me feel special, we were the Goddesses protecting the Earth, and she dubbed me at first Fonda-lee, caretaker of animals, but when her second in command, basically when a friend moved away, I was then dubbed Alora Diante.

 

Since then I have done not well in life, but now, she has entered my life again, and she is hardcore Christian, saying we sinned, in our childhood using our imaginations, she says that's a sin, and she wants to 'fix' me from those days so I don't go to hell...

 

Where did my imaginative friend go to? And she's really pushy too. I can't just meet up and say "hi" no, she's planned bible studies for me :/

[Cassine]

I'm a Christian and love God and my church family so much I'm surprised my heart hasn't burst. That being said, I know several Christians have a problem with shoving their religion down people's throats, which has results in the direct opposite of the desired result: pushing people farther away from God. Miss Xandria, I know you posted this months ago, so this is more directed to Miss Aloriality.

 

Both of your friends simply have your best interests at heart -- I'm not sure about your friends, but I have grown so much in my walk with God and am so filled with love that I want everyone else to experience this happiness, especially in this hard world. Try directing the conversation back at your friends -- ask them about why they are so proud to be Christians and why you should be Christian other than for fire insurance. Don't let them take the easy out of wanting to protect you from eternal suffering. If you have tried this, maybe explain that your friend's actions and words are only pushing you farther away God. After all, one of a Christian's most important tasks is to love, not to convict.

 

And Miss Aloriality -- I would hardly consider the imagination of a child sinful. Jesus loves children and even said that people should try to be more like children ("Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven." Matthew 18:3 - 4). Children are wonderful joys ^ ^

[~Xandria]

Both of your friends simply have your best interests at heart -- I'm not sure about your friends, but I have grown so much in my walk with God and am so filled with love that I want everyone else to experience this happiness, especially in this hard world. Try directing the conversation back at your friends -- ask them about why they are so proud to be Christians and why you should be Christian other than for fire insurance. Don't let them take the easy out of wanting to protect you from eternal suffering. If you have tried this, maybe explain that your friend's actions and words are only pushing you farther away God. After all, one of a Christian's most important tasks is to love, not to convict.

Sorry, I know this was posted quite some time ago so I just not got to this message. No offense intended Cassine but I want no one, especially my friend, to think she is saving me from "eternal damnation" by shoving her beliefs down my throat. I'm happy that other's have found happiness and strength and love in their religions, but that is not for me. I understand the reasoning behind it is supposed to be loving, but it does not come across that way to someone who does not believe in god.

[hanalways]

Sorry, I know this was posted quite some time ago so I just not got to this message. No offense intended Cassine but I want no one, especially my friend, to think she is saving me from "eternal damnation" by shoving her beliefs down my throat. I'm happy that other's have found happiness and strength and love in their religions, but that is not for me. I understand the reasoning behind it is supposed to be loving, but it does not come across that way to someone who does not believe in god.

 

Yes, but to them it's not just a thought - it's a reality. Have you ever predicted the consequence of a stupid teenager? Like, you see a teenager text while driving, and you just know they are going to get into an accident. To Christians that is what it is like to <i>not be Christian</I>. You are refusing Jesus Christ as your savior, so in essence, you are damning yourself to a life of eternal hell. But they see all the good in you, and they want you to be like them. You have to appreciate, in their perspective, they are doing it not to feel justified in having the "right" religion, or push their church's agenda on you, but to save you from something they feel like they know is going to happen.

 

I know this situation dearly because that is me and my best friend. I am SUPER agnostic. So freaking agnostic that I openly call myself stupid of religions. I don't know enough about any one to make a decisive decision, and I really don't have the mindset to think outside of this life, on this world - this reality. However, my friend is SUPER SUPER SUPER Christian. We have come to distinct terms, and have had to distance our really close relationship, because of this dissonance in religious views. But I never stop appreciating that, in his mind, he really does feel that he just wants to help. He realizes that "just trying to help" is driving a wedge between my affection towards our relationship and wanting to pull out my hair and become Muslim just to mess with EVERYONE. But realizing that they are just trying to help, and working at it from that angle really does wonders in coming to a common ground and not feeling like your friend is just aggressively attacking you for not sharing the same spiritual beliefs.

[~Xandria]

Yes, but to them it's not just a thought - it's a reality. Have you ever predicted the consequence of a stupid teenager? Like, you see a teenager text while driving, and you just know they are going to get into an accident. To Christians that is what it is like to <i>not be Christian</I>. You are refusing Jesus Christ as your savior, so in essence, you are damning yourself to a life of eternal hell. But they see all the good in you, and they want you to be like them. You have to appreciate, in their perspective, they are doing it not to feel justified in having the "right" religion, or push their church's agenda on you, but to save you from something they feel like they know is going to happen.

 

I know this situation dearly because that is me and my best friend. I am SUPER agnostic. So freaking agnostic that I openly call myself stupid of religions. I don't know enough about any one to make a decisive decision, and I really don't have the mindset to think outside of this life, on this world - this reality. However, my friend is SUPER SUPER SUPER Christian. We have come to distinct terms, and have had to distance our really close relationship, because of this dissonance in religious views. But I never stop appreciating that, in his mind, he really does feel that he just wants to help. He realizes that "just trying to help" is driving a wedge between my affection towards our relationship and wanting to pull out my hair and become Muslim just to mess with EVERYONE. But realizing that they are just trying to help, and working at it from that angle really does wonders in coming to a common ground and not feeling like your friend is just aggressively attacking you for not sharing the same spiritual beliefs.

I really like what you wrote - and trust me I totally see it from their perspective. It just sucks that all my christian friends think I'm going to wind up in hell as a non-believer. It's honestly pretty offensive, even though I get their reasoning. :(

[Zephyr]

Ohoho but the way to hell is paved with good intentions :P

 

This is a situation I'm all too familiar with as my dad is very much a religious Christian (& anti-gay. A few years back he was

also of the thinking that it's an illness).

My mom is a devout Buddist; I enjoy learning about Buddism teachings but I'm an atheist.

We have interesting dining table convos heh

 

Anyways, I'm glad to know that things between you & your friend work out :)

[~Xandria]

Ohoho but the way to hell is paved with good intentions :P

 

This is a situation I'm all too familiar with as my dad is very much a religious Christian (& anti-gay. A few years back he was

also of the thinking that it's an illness).

My mom is a devout Buddist; I enjoy learning about Buddism teachings but I'm an atheist.

We have interesting dining table convos heh

 

Anyways, I'm glad to know that things between you & your friend work out :)

Sounds very interesting. How odd. My mother in law is a pagan and I also enjoy learning about her religion. I got interested in Buddism of my own accord. While suffering from panic attacks I find meditation to be very helpful, after that I just started researching it all that I could. The teachings are interesting to say the least, but I'm still an atheist as well.

 

Crazy that your parents can have such opposing views yet still stay together. That's very uncommon. Congrats! :)

[Rozalind]

I am a catholic. No more no less.
Well... it was like that when i grew up. I never really had the chance to choose... not that i would do it.
It would be a giant drag to change religion and put up with their nuisance.
Although I did say that i am a catholic, my actions and the things i paid attention to clashed with my overly religious friends.
Whenever I asked advice from my best friend in college. (emotional stuff.), he would just tell me to read the bible and pray to God.
I understand that according to him God is awesome, but I need a concrete answer. I just told him thanks and moved on. He's still a friends of mine since we are class mates and he's part of my reverse Harem. haha. kidding! XD

Anyway, I understand that over-religious friends are annoying, but they want the very best for you and for them, their religion is their trump card. Please, don't come to hate your friend. i don't know any of you, but I'm sure she wants to remain friends as much as you do. The most effective method is a direct one. Invite her or get a time and talk it out. Be straightforward and tell her that you don't want religion to be the one destroying the friendship you have. After all, a God may or may not exist, but friends are always there.

[Novelista]

I hate it when religion comes between friends. Marx said, "Religion is the opiate of the people" (gods, I can't believe I'm quoting Marx!)...I wonder if, at that time, he knew it was also "the major clashing point of the people"! (I think he'd have been further off saying that!) In fact, I don't even think politics is more divisive. Last I checked, no one said you'd go to hell (or whatever punishment you believe in) just for being a Democrat or a Republican. (And if they have said that, I don't want to know 'em!)

 

I'm glad you worked things out with your friend, Xandria. I'm also glad you're more patient than I am! Sometimes, I've seen it far more fit to take off than to deal with (pardon my phrasing) Christians who love their religion too much. I respect people who are passionate about their beliefs, but I don't respect them for trying to shove those same beliefs down my throat. One Pagan saying I'm fond of (and I'm sure it's not just Wiccans) is that we don't prosthelytize, because if someone is meant to be a part of what we do, they'll be called. I wish all faiths felt that way!

 

What I'm going to say next may irritate some people, so I just want to throw in that I'm not completely "anti-established-religion". I'll go to something if it doesn't look like it'll be too religious-y (like fundraisers at my mom's church--especially when they concern the kids), but if it even smacks of too much Christianity, I'll be like, "Bye! (zap)"

 

Okay, this is the part that may bother some people: I honestly read the paper (and other things) and--more and more often these days--think, "Wow, I'm glad I'm not Christian anymore!" All these letters to the editor that say "the bible says this", "the bible says that"; "yes, gay marriage", "no gay marriage" (whatever happened to just believing in love?!) Or one that's been in the news since the weekend: a local church that has been around for eighty years was recently condemned because of warring factions. Literally...by the fire department. One faction was so angry with the other that they put up steel over some of the doors, broke keys off in locks and chained up others. HELLO?! You call yourselves Christians?! That's just freaking shameful. I realize all faiths, of every stripe, have problems with each other (look at people dying in the Middle East because they're one type of Muslim or another!), but following my own belief system has become more and more attractive for me the older I get. I live by love, care and compassion; and if someone doesn't like it, they can bug off!

[KrellVitor]

I usually tell them to stop and if they persist I ignore them. I am fine with talking religion but I am not changing my beliefs for another person. I'm wiccan and I am happy working on my path. It has done me a lot of good in terms of personal and spiritual growth. I think it is great if a friend wants to share what has done them good in their life too. However if they want to use their religion as a weapon or a n excuse to be racist, sexist, or homophobic then I want nothing to do with them. I don't waste my time on bigots. I have more positive people to keep in my life.