zerwey Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Here is an article just posted today.... --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CHICAGO - Treffly Coyne was out of her car for just minutes and no more than 10 yards away. But that was long and far enough to land her in court after a police officer spotted her sleeping 2-year-old daughter alone in the vehicle; Coyne had taken her two older daughters to pour $8.29 in coins into a Salvation Army kettle. Minutes later, she was under arrest — the focus of both a police investigation and a probe by the state’s child welfare agency. Now the case that has become an Internet flash point for people who either blast police for overstepping their authority or Coyne for putting a child in danger. The 36-year-old suburban mother is preparing to go on trial Thursday on misdemeanor charges of child endangerment and obstructing a peace officer. If convicted, she could be sentenced to a year in jail and fined $2,500, even though child welfare workers found no credible evidence of abuse or neglect. On Dec. 8 Coyne decided to drive to Wal-Mart in the Chicago suburb of Crestwood so her children and a young friend could donate the coins they’d collected at her husband’s office. Even as she buckled 2-year-old Phoebe into the car, the girl was asleep. When Coyne arrived at the store, she found a spot to park in a loading zone, right behind someone tying a Christmas tree onto a car. “It’s sleeting out, it’s not pleasant, I don’t want to disturb her, wake her up,†Coyne said this week. “It was safer to leave her in the safety and warmth of an alarmed car than take her.†So Coyne switched on the emergency flashers, locked the car, activated the alarm and walked the other children to the bell ringer. She snapped a few pictures of the girls donating money and headed back to the car. But a community service officer blocked her way. “She was on a tirade, she was yelling at me,†Coyne said. The officer, Coyne said, didn’t want to hear about how close Coyne was, how she never set foot inside the store and was just there to let the kids donate money, or how she could always see her car. Coyne telephoned her husband, Tim Janecyk, who advised her not to say anything else to police until he arrived. So Coyne declined to talk further, refusing even to tell police her child’s name. When Janecyk pulled up, his wife already was handcuffed, sitting in a patrol car. Crestwood Police Chief Timothy Sulikowski declined to comment about the case. But he did not dispute the contention that Coyne parked nearby or was away from her car for just a few minutes. He did, however, suggest Coyne put her child at risk. “A minute or two, that’s when things can happen,†he said. Online debate Talk about the case has intensified, particularly online, where bloggers are weighing in on various message boards. Many have harsh words for the police department, calling the arrest of a mother who left her child in a locked car for a few minutes an abuse of authority. Yet statistics show thousands of children are injured and dozens die every year after being left unattended near or inside vehicles. “I am talking tens of thousands of people who leave their kids in the car for any period of time all around America,†said Janette Fennell, founder and president of Kansas-based Kids and Cars. “People don’t appreciate the dangers of leaving a child alone in the car.†Coyne’s attorney, Michelle Forbes, argued that Coyne did not break the law any more than a mother who parks in front of a school in a rainstorm and leaves an infant in the car as she runs a few feet to pick up another child. “As long as the car is not out of her sight, then the child is not unattended,†she said. Coyne and her husband believe she is unfairly being lumped in with parents who put their children’s lives at risk. “If I were going on a shopping spree then, yes, I would deserve arrest,†Coyne said. “I was standing right there. I never went into the store. “I’m a great parent.†------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ So, discuss. Was this arrest fair or unfair. Me, I think it was extremely unfair. The woman was 1) donating something, 2) within thirty feet of her car, and 3)did not set foot inside the store. So, what's your opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muchabi Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 I think the arrest is unfair too. It was a few minutes, and she was in range of her car. She's right about disturbing the baby and taking it out in sleet being the worse option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antiaircraft Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 I'd have to say that I'm currently undecided... while it does seem unfair to arrest the woman since she was still reasonably close to the car and with a clear line of sight, there are many things that could happen to a child left inside a car within the space of a few seconds and/or with no visible signs from outside the car. By the way, shouldn't this topic be in the debate forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie_Penguin Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 I think it was fair, you really need to start enforcing the law before something terrible happens. That's how accidents start, she leaves the child then what if she sees a friend? She could easily get distracted and something could happen to the child. You should NEVER leave a child unattended! Abductions can happen any SECOND. Of course, I don't think they should send her to jail for that, but getting arrested is good enough of a warning. Sure, you might think it is "safe" to leave a child in the car if you are only a few yards away, but if something happened then you could face charges for "negligence". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revenge Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 This should be moved to the debate forum. It really is more appropriate there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crxsnochic Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 I say unfair... Given the options... sleet on sleeping baby... then baby might get pneumonia or other sickness (reasonable chance of occurance) or have a baby in a car that you can see and you're only gone for a couple minutes and within yards of... (chance of abduction, etc... very slim) I think she made the better choice. Yeah, should probably be in the debate section though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dillon Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 I am teetering on undecided/fair. She broke a law regardless of how long it was in the car alone. and like with what ellie said. Abductions happen all the tiem. she could see a friend. get sidetracked etc etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOOM Bringer Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 I am also undecided on this for reasons similar to Dillon. While it was a harmless mistake, the law is a law and it would send a bad message to others if they let her off because it was a light infringement. There shouldn't really be exceptions to the law. That being said, there is also the previously brought up pneumonia problem if she had brought the baby and also the fact that she could still see the car. So I'll just sit on the fence here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie_Penguin Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 I think the situation is both fair and unfair. Fair because she was technically neglecting the child; however, one year in jail is an exaggeration. I think she should just pay a fine and receive a warning, and perhaps some jail time, but one year in jail? There are people out there who do WORSE things and don't even get an hour in jail. It doesn't matter if you go out to donate money, you still can't leave your child alone. But, if something had happened to the girl then she would've being charged with negligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antiaircraft Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 *Sticks hand in the air for random mod to move this topic* I'd just like to say that I agree with the points brought up recently as well... :yes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Levy Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 Its fair. You NEVER NEVER NEVER leave a child alone, even for a few minutes. That's my opinion and I am sticking to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anime Posted March 15, 2008 Share Posted March 15, 2008 This topic has been edited by a member of staff (Anime Heart). The topic was posted in the wrong area. Please check your user inbox to see if you have been contacted regarding this topic. Per the reason above, this topic has been MOVED from ‘Random Chit Chat’ to ‘ Debate and Discussion’. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sandi Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 Well, if it was hot in the car, She shouldn't have left her there. Someone i know left her kid in the car for 45 minutes in the southwest (summertime, no less) 2 seprate occasions.... This kid now has Aspergers Syndrome. I'm not decided on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m3l3ana Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 It was the middle of winter, so unless the heater was on full bore, I don't think it was hot in the car. I am undecided. Yes I think it is fair that she got in trouble for leaving her child unattended in the car, not I don't think it is fair that she got arrested or that she may have to spend 1 year in jail. Personally I think that unless you leave your child in the car for hours etc and there is proof of that then yes you should go to jail, but I don't think she should be imprisoned for leaving her child for five mins to go donate some coins. The only way I leave my daughter in the car by herself is if I am going to the post box and then I park the car right in front, so that I can see her at all times, plus it only takes about 10 seconds to get the post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furry Curry Level 3 Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 I believe it was unfair. If I read the story straight then it was sleeting out and it seems the child may have been in more danger to be put in those elements. Also, the doors were locked so the possibility of abduction was not really there. I really don't understand that in the time it takes to walk t o a building, put some coins in a pot and walk back someone felt the need to stop this woman and charge her with endangerment. It's really unbelievable. In my area recently there was a woman who was caught leaving her child in the car twice for long periods of time with the windows up and the third time the mother went to go inside a doughnut shop to get pastries for her coworkers and forgot the child was in the car. the child ended up dying either while the mother was in the shop or the mother then drove to work and forgot she was in there. That situation would definitely give cause for alarm and the mother should have gone to jail for along time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkOfEternity Posted May 29, 2008 Share Posted May 29, 2008 It was unfair. Period. I have children, myself. The child was restrained, in a locked vehicle, in plain sight of the mother. I will argue tooth and nail with anyone who suggests that she "broke a law" by leaving her child in the vehicle. Why? Because it's also my personal belief that if a law infringes on or violates a personal freedom -- such as the freedom to allow your child to sleep safely and comfortably (keyword: safely) -- then the law should not only be IGNORED, but overturned. Now, I've probably stepped on some of your toes, and I apologize. But quite frankly, I think the government has taken too much liberty in taking away ours. Yes... I am one of those kind of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jamieleigh Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 I don't think it was fair. Laws like these should really be enforced on a case to case bases. As I believe some of you have already said, had it have been really hot out side and had the child been left for an extended amount of time, then there would have been a problem, but here, that was not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m3l3ana Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 It was unfair. Period. I have children, myself. The child was restrained, in a locked vehicle, in plain sight of the mother. I will argue tooth and nail with anyone who suggests that she "broke a law" by leaving her child in the vehicle. Why? Because it's also my personal belief that if a law infringes on or violates a personal freedom -- such as the freedom to allow your child to sleep safely and comfortably (keyword: safely) -- then the law should not only be IGNORED, but overturned. Now, I've probably stepped on some of your toes, and I apologize. But quite frankly, I think the government has taken too much liberty in taking away ours. Yes... I am one of those kind of people. One of those aye??!! I see where you are coming from, but since it is the LAW and she DID break it, do you think the cops reactions were unfair? I think that yes she should get a warning and a slap on the hand because yes she did BREAK the law, but other than that no I don't think she should be punished for what she did. I would have refused to take my child out in the sleet no matter what! A lot of the time my child does not come out to the shop with me if it is bad weather outside, because the last thing I want or need is for her to get sick!! Then again, could she not have donated the coins another day? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spunky_munky_gal Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 I too think this is unfair and my heart goes out to this woman. Yes, leaving children in cars can be dangerous - in summer, or when some criminal type can access the vehicle. Neither of these situations were in play here (the car was locked, it was winter, the child was restrained). But more to the point - life is dangerous. It only takes a two-year-old a couple of seconds to run onto a road, grab something dangerous, or just trip and knock their head. It is physically impossible to watch your kids 24/7. Not to mention the fact that it's counter-productive. Constantly protecting them means they don't learn to protect themselves. This wasn't a case of a parent leaving their child in the car while they got drunk at the bar or played the pokies or something. I have often left my sleeping baby for a couple of minutes, always while I can see the car and always in cool weather. I defy any law enforcement agency to tell me i'm a bad mum because of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antiaircraft Posted May 31, 2008 Share Posted May 31, 2008 Okay, I'd just like to say that being sentenced to a year in jail and a $2,500 fine is far from fair in this situation. However, I also agree that a warning could plausibly have been warranted (though an arrest is probably going too far). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkOfEternity Posted May 31, 2008 Share Posted May 31, 2008 I actually talked this debate over with my family and friends... and surprisingly they have little interest in that law. Apparently, we all feel that this particular law serves very little purpose. My personal feeling is that the law itself should be rewritten to better suit circumstances. It is obvious that the woman was not putting her child in any danger, unintentional or otherwise, so why do we have a law against something benign? Perhaps the cop was just having an off day and decided to vent on the poor woman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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