TNT being Greedy

[Spritzie]

I'm sure no one has ever yelled "DANG YOU NEOPETTTSSSSSS!" at the sky while shaking their fist because they just realized they couldn't afford to feed their families this month because they spent all their money at the NC Mall. o_O

 

:laughingsmiley: Wow. That's just awesome. I completely just pictured someone doing that.

[Chu]

Oh, please. The recession is a terrible cop-out. People need to stop blowing it out of proportion and realize that it's not stretching your pocketbooks too far. My single mother is raising three children on tips at work, and we're okay. It takes good management but it'll work. >_> I'm so tired of hearing that excuse.

 

 

But that's another subject. TNT can't help that people don't have money to spend, or simply won't spend it. They're not selfish merely for saying "Hey, you can buy this if you want it."

[sassylx]

blah too many customisations, too little time.

[Christine M]

Chu is my favorite newbie ever. Everything she said is spot-on.

 

It looks like some of you are just whining because some people get nice items by spending real money for them and you don't want to spend money, because you're cheap neopets should be freeee wahhhh.

 

I complain about NC because it ISN'T fair. No matter what TNT says, that's the truth. For example, I just spent 2M+ on the kacheek pyjama set. Why? No other NP item looked as good. If I had about $5-10 worth of NC, I would be 2M richer. It's basically paying for NP.

 

It also means that NP items are more expensive. Because all the NC-overdosed pets are kinda hard to ignore since they have a spotlight, a spot beneath our avvies, and their own board (2 if you count the NC board), users still want to customize their pets. They're going to spend some form of currency on them. Because most species clothes are r90+, it means massively inflated, unpriced items for NP users.

 

I also don't like the idea that the site I grew up with, which was so great at teaching kids to work hard and earn what they wanted, now offers an easy copout.

 

As for its affordability, I'll give you my personal little anecdote. I'm a 17 year old interning in NYC. I pay my own rent, and I work minimum wage. To make ends meet, I literally live off of $10 a day. This isn't to say I'd starve to death if I got a NC card, but there are people and families far less fortunate than me who actually can't afford it - underprivileged kids who would be playing on a biased site.

[Chu]

Neopets is a business though, and I see nothing wrong with them using those practices. Nothing is unfair or shady as far as I can see. When I came back to Neo from a long hiatus, I didn't even notice the NC updates until a user mentioned them, so I think that that goes to say that they can easily be ignored.

 

And the concept of working hard for your items/currency is still in tact - even if a user buys NC, they worked hard for that real-life money that they just forked over. Yes, the concept is a tad bit skewed with that group of children who merely convince their parents to spend money on the site, but honestly, that's on the parents, not TNT. For every other child on the site, they work just as hard for their items as a child of the past would have.

 

And quickly regarding your example, Christine M, you don't need that item to do anything on-site, and you can't blame TNT for the price of it. TNT doesn't set that - the users do through supply and demand. And I don't mean this to be insulting or rude, but the impression that you're making is, "It's not fair because otherwise I'd be 2mil richer!" I'm not going to hold that over your head, but it seemed like something that I should point out.

 

 

I actually find how TNT handles themselves quite fair and commendable. I'd be the last person to white knight them and blindly bow down, but they handle themselves just as a business should. They're not wishy-washy like some other popular sites. I've never spent any money on this site, yet I can still enjoy it just as I did as a kid. That said, if others are complaining that it's not the same as when they used to play, I'd like to ask why. Exactly what did this change for anyone if they choose not to buy NC?

[Christine M]

Neopets is a business though, and I see nothing wrong with them using those practices. Nothing is unfair or shady as far as I can see. When I came back to Neo from a long hiatus, I didn't even notice the NC updates until a user mentioned them, so I think that that goes to say that they can easily be ignored.

 

And the concept of working hard for your items/currency is still in tact - even if a user buys NC, they worked hard for that real-life money that they just forked over. Yes, the concept is a tad bit skewed with that group of children who merely convince their parents to spend money on the site, but honestly, that's on the parents, not TNT. For every other child on the site, they work just as hard for their items as a child of the past would have.

 

And quickly regarding your example, Christine M, you don't need that item to do anything on-site, and you can't blame TNT for the price of it. TNT doesn't set that - the users do through supply and demand. And I don't mean this to be insulting or rude, but the impression that you're making is, "It's not fair because otherwise I'd be 2mil richer!" I'm not going to hold that over your head, but it seemed like something that I should point out.

 

 

I actually find how TNT handles themselves quite fair and commendable. I'd be the last person to white knight them and blindly bow down, but they handle themselves just as a business should. They're not wishy-washy like some other popular sites. I've never spent any money on this site, yet I can still enjoy it just as I did as a kid. That said, if others are complaining that it's not the same as when they used to play, I'd like to ask why. Exactly what did this change for anyone if they choose not to buy NC?

 

I never said TNT doesn't have the right to charge for NC. I don't really even think they're "greedy" to do so: they've spent millions of dollars buying the site and are entitled to maximize their profitability. They own the right and it's a legitimate business. And for being owned by such a conglomerate, it isn't as bad as it could be.

 

What I am questioning is the ethics of their practices. Neopets is still geared toward kids, and the vast majority are kids. So the concept is more than just a "tad bit skewed". Kids are the ones who are most susceptible to the advertising. They're the ones that see that their friends have NC and end up wondering why they don't.

 

I was actually just using my example to make a poinr. So to clarify, here's a less specific scenario:

Two users have 1 M each. One spends 500k to dress their pet. The other spends NC. The user with NC has more NP to spend on other things on site than the other. Ex: one user can now buy a lab ray, the other cannot.

 

And you're a little off on the supply and demand. That kind of model only works in a free market with transparent market prices. Supply is actually determined by TNT. Demand is determined indirectly by TNT, since they determine the look of the item and they promote customization in the first place. So if you have two sellers unwilling to list their prices and a hundred confused buyers, you aren't exactly in a fair market.

 

The principle is the same. It's not a fair game if people with outside resources get more. TNT needs to stop deluding itself and everyone else.

[Spritzie]

Two users have 1 M each. One spends 500k to dress their pet. The other spends NC. The user with NC has more NP to spend on other things on site than the other. Ex: one user can now buy a lab ray, the other cannot.

 

 

The principle is the same. It's not a fair game if people with outside resources get more. TNT needs to stop deluding itself and everyone else.

With the example of the 2 users: Not all that many users have enough NP that they can drop it on anything without worrying about it. Most users will always have to pick between things, to decide which they want more. And, NC items are always different than NP. I could understand if NC items and NP items were the same, then NC users could get the exact same thing, but without spending NP.

 

 

The way I see it, with the statement of it being unfair... it doesn't make it unfair. It would only be unfair if it gave users who used NC an advantage, which it doesn't. There's no BD items, or anything that makes things better/easier for NC users. It simply has different items, or special prizes. But because you can't trade or sell them, they can't make NP off them.

[Noog]

I agree with spritzie. Your example doesn't make any sense because the two people aren't buying the same thing. That's kinda like saying it's unfair to me when I feed my pets at Kelp because someone who fed their pet with omelettes(spelling?) didn't have to spend the same amount as me. Since one user was buying NC items, they did not get the same items or value as the person who just spent neopoints.

[Divya Bean]

And what is the big deal? Its a game! I know it is important (kinda), but why does it matter? And if it does (wow, I feel like a hypocrite), TNT needs to make money in order to come out with more stuff for the free site! :yes:

[Spritzie]

TNT needs to make money in order to come out with more stuff for the free site! :yes:

 

Exactly. They can't run things for free. It amazes me when I see people say that TNT should remove ads and the NC Mall. But it brings in the revenue they need.

 

The way I look at it, if you don't like NC, or think it's a bad idea... don't use it. It doesn't change the game for anyone. It just gives people different options if they want/can afford it. Just because some people don't like it, doesn't mean TNT is greedy, or that it should be removed and made so people who do like it and use it, can't.

[Divya Bean]

Exactly! If you dont want it, dont get it. And dont complain. TNT is HELPING us by having NC, even though it might seem otherwise! Just read the above posts to find out why because I will NOT reiterate myself. Good use of the word "reiterate", Divya. *pats self on the back* :laughingsmiley:

[Christine M]

With the example of the 2 users: Not all that many users have enough NP that they can drop it on anything without worrying about it. Most users will always have to pick between things, to decide which they want more. And, NC items are always different than NP. I could understand if NC items and NP items were the same, then NC users could get the exact same thing, but without spending NP.

 

 

The way I see it, with the statement of it being unfair... it doesn't make it unfair. It would only be unfair if it gave users who used NC an advantage, which it doesn't. There's no BD items, or anything that makes things better/easier for NC users. It simply has different items, or special prizes. But because you can't trade or sell them, they can't make NP off them.

 

You guys forget that you CAN get NP items from NC challenges. If a user buys those items from a NC user with NP, doesn't that give the user with NC an advantage? It also again leaves the user with NP with less than the NC user. The NC card bonus items, especially the older ones, are great investments because they can turn around and sell for massive amounts of NP. Ex, the plushie string v-day lights or w/e are going for 5M. So in some cases, it's a big advantage to users that can get those items easily.

 

Not to mention the NC items are arguably better as far as wearables and furniture. Have you SEEN the NP backgrounds in comparison to the animated backgrounds at the NC mall? (Broken stained glass window vs. sparkling animated stained glass background with shiny lighs everywhere? :P) The point is, if most people had NC, they would never, ever be spending NP on backgrounds. Or most handhelds, wearables, and multi-species items.

 

NC only assists TNT with site maintenance. It pays for the staff, but like any other pay-for-use feature, ultimately it just puts more money in Viacom's pocket. Of everything that they make, they only invest a small fraction back into site development. There are definitely some perks to the site new features, but we haven't had a war or a really cool plot in quite some time, and UCs are no longer available. So it's definitely a give and take, and its really a user's personal preference whether or not its better.

 

And granted it's not a big, big deal, but this IS a Neopets debate forum. ^^

[LadyLizzyDevine]

Ah, I don't waste money on virtual items.

 

I don't like how most of the site's in Flash though, it slows my computer.

 

And the ads- geez, I've actually gotten a few pop-ups in the last few days!

Neopets is going crazy. D:

[Torontox]

They SHOULD get a lot of money from neopets.

It has milion views per day, they has a swarm of accounts.

Its a very good business. So they did NC Mall, Premium, and another stuff like that.

[shiranui_xiii]

I think both TNT and the users are both greedy. TNT has placed ads everywhere on the website, and then we have Premium Accounts and NeoCash. There's nothing wrong with that, though, because Neopets *is* a business now. But it seems like TNT is trying to milk every last penny out of its customers by making the "better" looking items NC-only.

 

On the other hand, the users just want more and more free content. They think NC is stupid. But they have to understand Neopets is a business. At least there's an option to play for free. Using real money anywhere on the site isn't a requirement. We users should be more grateful that we can still play for free.

[Quark]

To those complaining about ads--There are lots of very good ad block programs. I use AdBlockPlus in Firefox and I haven't seen a single ad on Neopets (or anywhere else for that matter) since.

I don't think TNT is greedy. I'd rather there be some OPTIONAL pay portions of the site than to see Neopets lose money and shut down. (Now that would be a shame! What would you all do?) As long as the site is free to play we should all be happy. Yes, the old Neopets had a lot of fun features that don't seem to come around as often, but those features have been traded for others. It's the ever moving zeitgeist, nothing can stay the same forever. What's the fun in that?

I mean, man, at least it's only the NC Mall. Anyone play Zynga games on Facebook? Practically EVERY new items on their games can only be bought with cash. Neopets segregates the pay items from Neopoint items and it seems they always will, so that's a definite plus.

All in all, I really support TNT. I haven't seen anything morally apprehensive about their actions.

[Bloom]

I don't think that they are being greedy. They are just trying to make sure that they are up in their business. Marapets, another virtual pet site and Gaiaonline, an anime virtual site, had both started the whole using real money for virtual money before Neopets ever started doing it. It's all competitive marketing.

 

Personally, I am not a fan of the whole buy with your money and get random items online thing. But if it helps them make extra money for extra events like the Daily Dare and the Altador Cup, then I'm all for it. I won't be their candidate to spend my money, but I will be to do their events and plots. (:

[shiranui_xiii]

I've played Marapets before. It was cute, but I didn't enjoy it. Every single pet I wanted was Limited Edition, and of course, I didn't want to pay the few dollars just to get one.

 

I think that Premium, the NC Mall, etc., is actually a good thing for the people that don't use real money. Neopets costs money to upkeep, and if everyone decided all of a sudden that Premium and the NC Mall weren't worth it, we'd probably have to go somewhere else.

[CAV of Gang Green]

I complain about NC because it ISN'T fair. No matter what TNT says, that's the truth. For example, I just spent 2M+ on the kacheek pyjama set. Why? No other NP item looked as good. If I had about $5-10 worth of NC, I would be 2M richer. It's basically paying for NP.

 

It also means that NP items are more expensive. Because all the NC-overdosed pets are kinda hard to ignore since they have a spotlight, a spot beneath our avvies, and their own board (2 if you count the NC board), users still want to customize their pets. They're going to spend some form of currency on them. Because most species clothes are r90+, it means massively inflated, unpriced items for NP users.

 

I also don't like the idea that the site I grew up with, which was so great at teaching kids to work hard and earn what they wanted, now offers an easy copout.

 

As for its affordability, I'll give you my personal little anecdote. I'm a 17 year old interning in NYC. I pay my own rent, and I work minimum wage. To make ends meet, I literally live off of $10 a day. This isn't to say I'd starve to death if I got a NC card, but there are people and families far less fortunate than me who actually can't afford it - underprivileged kids who would be playing on a biased site.

 

Christine M is my favorite new member of all time. She stole the words right out of my mouth.

[Bloom]

So I agree with the whole thing that Neopoint-items will now be more expensive and the pay of getting NeoCash would be expensive as well, but who said you need to use your money? Are you that easy to get pulled into something like that because you see neopets hosting a spotlight contest? I think what they are doing to grab people's attention could be greedy, but what they have put onto their site feature-wise is not. The features are perfect for those who do want to get unlimited items and stop advertisements, but how they get your attention is wrong in my opinion.

 

Premiums - For those who are collectors, if you pay for premium you get an avatar that you can only get when you pay. When you stop paying your avatar disappears. Also, your ads are gone.

 

NC-Mall - You gain items that would be very expensive if bought through neopoints and there are items that cannot be purchased from neopoints at all such as Neoboard Pens that are pretty cool. And they get you trophy-wise with the whole customization contest.

 

So they have good advertising techniques to hook you in, but in general, the features are brilliant for them to make money and provide us with something better.

[vivien]

esp with the introduction of tokens

 

tsk tsk tnt

[deltro]

The only reason neopets exists is so that they can make money. Don't be surprised.

[kathleen_a_b]

I don't think TNT is being greedy. No one is forced to buy neocash or pay for premium; doing so would provide more features and options for customization, but it isn't necessary to play the game. It is simply available to those who do want it. Plus, some money is needed to run a website, so if there was no income to neopets, it would disappear.

[Princess_Megan]

I don't think they're being greedy, I read that they keep a limit so that the site isn't so slow or something like that. As for the old stuff, I will admit that sometimes I wish I could still use some of the old stuff but honestly if I never did anything with it then why would I need to now?

 

I am a fan of all the new stuff they keep giving us!

[Christine M]

Wow, a lot of new posts xD

 

It's true that Neopets is a business, but they WOULD be okay running just on a few ads or sponsors. Under no circumstances would, barring every user leaving mysteriously, would Neopets shut down. Even without premium, huge ads, or the NC mall, they already make more than enough to maintain and update! They just want more. So you could definitely argue that they're greedy - like any for-profit company. They've now reached a point where they're already making a lot, but looking for more at the expense of some features that users like. (Can ANYONE tell me that they don't want UC's back or another war/epic plot?) That stuff doesn't make as much money as NC mall items or their game tickets, so that's what they end up promoting and developing.

 

As to the comment that "we're lucky" Neopet's isn't a paysite, most people would just leave or not join if it were. They know that only a small portion can afford to pay to use, and they would lose users in droves if they started charging. It would basically mean rebuilding their entire demographic. In the meanwhile, they'd lose sponsors, ads, and would be massively overstaffed. Charging us to use the site does them more harm then it does us.

 

I guess it's a fact of life that this is how companies are, let's just not go so far as to say that TNT/Viacom is doing this for OUR benefit or the benefit of the site's quality.