dazara Posted January 22, 2009 Author Share Posted January 22, 2009 Listen, I'm only 15. I'm not the smartest guy in the world. But it just seems common sense to say that if somebody is in your space-- I'm NOT saying this is the entire problem. I haven't researched this, it's just coming from me. But--some body is obstructing your future, potentially. Maybe you don't your future there to end? Maybe? I don't know if you get what I'm saying, but we're not wiping out an entire species for fun. But, If you think something is going to go wrong, you'd want to prevent it. This is true for both sides, but not one side alone. We are animals too. In most cases if you invade another animals territory threateningly, note that I said threateningly, 'cause we do coexist with animals, that animal will attack. Now I completely lost my train of thought, so I'm gonna end it here. Just be considerate of both sides and stop acting like whoever doesn't agree with you is an evil, cruel person, dazara. I'm not. I'm simply sticking up for what I believe in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FutureTXTurkey Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 I just found this on WhiteHouse.gov and thought it was kind of interesting/relevant. This is President Obama's stance on the issue. I find it no big surprise that I agree with him: "President Obama did not grow up hunting and fishing, but he recognizes the great conservation legacy of America's hunters and anglers and has great respect for the passion that hunters and anglers have for their sports. Were it not for America's hunters and anglers, including the great icons like Theodore Roosevelt and Aldo Leopold, our nation would not have the tradition of sound game management, a system of ethical, science-based game laws and an extensive public lands estate on which to pursue the sport. The President and Vice President recognize that we must forge a broad coalition if we are to address the great conservation challenges we face. America's hunters and anglers are a key constituency that must take an active role and have a powerful voice in this coalition." Obviously I added the bolded and red text...just wanted to emphasize the points I found especially poignant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazara Posted February 13, 2009 Author Share Posted February 13, 2009 I just found this on WhiteHouse.gov and thought it was kind of interesting/relevant. This is President Obama's stance on the issue. I find it no big surprise that I agree with him: "President Obama did not grow up hunting and fishing, but he recognizes the great conservation legacy of America's hunters and anglers and has great respect for the passion that hunters and anglers have for their sports. Were it not for America's hunters and anglers, including the great icons like Theodore Roosevelt and Aldo Leopold, our nation would not have the tradition of sound game management, a system of ethical, science-based game laws and an extensive public lands estate on which to pursue the sport. The President and Vice President recognize that we must forge a broad coalition if we are to address the great conservation challenges we face. America's hunters and anglers are a key constituency that must take an active role and have a powerful voice in this coalition." Obviously I added the bolded and red text...just wanted to emphasize the points I found especially poignant. I'm not American. Lol. This post has been edited by a member of staff (Ruto) because of a violation of the forum rules. Please make sure all posts have at least seven words. Quotes don't count. Also, stick with the discussion; do not go off-topic. Please check your user inbox to see if you have been contacted regarding this incident, then review our rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kindii Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 quote from the page before: And us humans have complex thoughts, unlike animals. Their thoughts and feelings are basically hunger, "need food", and fear. We have more complex thoughts. Therefore your analogy of a higher being killing us is a poor one. Plus, animals don't mourn over death the same way we do. They have no sense of family or friends. No sense of love. all i can say it this is so totally wrong. ever seen an elephant greive over anothers bones even our own pets grieve. mine did when we had to put our oldest dog down. dolphins and whales are some of the most inteigent species. they have thier own lauguae and will help one of their own if its sick. i also disagree with the way humans think that they have to control the enviroment. yes they do kill elephants the call it culling but its a bunch of bull. though its no where near as bad as we treat the ones we have in captivety but i will leave that for another topic. oh and one last thing animals have a sense of love there are birds that if their mate dies they will never look for another mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unstream Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 As the dominant species, we do kinda control the things that go around. I mean, I doubt animals can reason or use logic. And I'm pretty sure they can't predict the outcome of their actions. We humans can though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livvy Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 @Unstream: Sad thing is, so many humans DON'T bother to use logic and think about the consequences of their actions that I sometimes think we really shouldn't be the ones controlling what goes on around us. But that's a whole different debate. I think killing animals for NECESSARY population control is okay; where it gets messy is when it comes to what qualifies as necessary. I don't really know how you'd distinguish "necessary" from human selfishness. (Scientifically, I mean. I know they're different.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unstream Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 Well, if an animal is overpopulated, they'll end up dying off anyway, since there won't be enough prey for them, and then the prey will die off too. That's why it's necessary. And, well, necessity would probably be point of view too. I mean, what's necessary for us to survive might not be considered necessary for other animals, but the animal would die off from starvation. We're really the only beings that can predict and anticipate what will happen, and that's why we must take the responsibility to step in where needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Diva Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 We had this big discussion in our resource management component at university. How do you distinguish what should be classified as animal population control and what shouldn't. In Australia we have a problem with people getting domesticated animals and lumping them in the bush so we have quite a few feral cats that cause all sorts of problems with the wildlife as well as rabbits... Many go out on culling weekends with kangaroo's. I'm a greenie at heart and it does break my heart to know that there are people out there killing endangered species for their own gain, however at what price do we start culling those animals which we think have too big a population? I mean I nearly died when they wanted to cull the dingo population. I believe I wrote to quite a few politicians on the point. I abhor killing a creature because it has done what it does naturally and attacked when a human has invaded their territory - I guess what I'm trying to say is that I can see both sides and each side has a valid point. Yet, I believe that as the dominant species with brains that can reason we should be able to find a solution that doesn't involve shooting animals, setting traps or any kind of cruel mechanism to deal with wild animals. Especially since they had always died out if their population got out of control, without the aid of humans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
safetymath Posted February 22, 2009 Share Posted February 22, 2009 There is, in fact, an overpopulation of elephants in some parts of Africa due to more nature reserves and the banning of poachers. Personally I don't think elephants should be killed even if they take over the world. We had this big discussion in our resource management component at university. How do you distinguish what should be classified as animal population control and what shouldn't. In Australia we have a problem with people getting domesticated animals and lumping them in the bush so we have quite a few feral cats that cause all sorts of problems with the wildlife as well as rabbits... Many go out on culling weekends with kangaroo's. I'm a greenie at heart and it does break my heart to know that there are people out there killing endangered species for their own gain, however at what price do we start culling those animals which we think have too big a population? I mean I nearly died when they wanted to cull the dingo population. I believe I wrote to quite a few politicians on the point. I abhor killing a creature because it has done what it does naturally and attacked when a human has invaded their territory - I guess what I'm trying to say is that I can see both sides and each side has a valid point. Yet, I believe that as the dominant species with brains that can reason we should be able to find a solution that doesn't involve shooting animals, setting traps or any kind of cruel mechanism to deal with wild animals. Especially since they had always died out if their population got out of control, without the aid of humans. I think I saw a documentary about the overpopulation of rabbits in Australia...apparently they cause $600 million worth of damage per year, and so scientists created a virus that kills adult rabbits. What a moral dilemma :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapphy the Swamp Witch Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Er, elephants and seals? Aren't they endangered or something? Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't really think its right...I mean, the human population is the one that is the most out of control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jejune Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 And us humans have complex thoughts, unlike animals. Their thoughts and feelings are basically hunger, "need food", and fear. We have more complex thoughts. Therefore your analogy of a higher being killing us is a poor one. Plus, animals don't mourn over death the same way we do. They have no sense of family or friends. No sense of love. LOL. Have you ever even had a dog? Yeah in the Australian country kangaroos are sometimes culled because there can be overpopulated groups around the crops... But killing off, say, dingoes because of attacks is stupid. Just recently there have been two or three shark attacks and some people want some "population control". Despite the fact that, if you swim in the ocean there's always a small risk; rips kill way more people than sharks; shark attacks are extremely rare and a couple just happened to occur within a few weeks; and hundreds of thousands of sharks are slaughtered each year already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovedwallflower Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 as soon as i saw this i thought of our neighbourhood..we have stray cats all over the place and the more time passes the more the problem grows. now these cats are a. dirty and therefore b. sick and also c. in danger or being run over or of being the victims of some heartless human beings. now some people insist on feeding these cats by leaving leftovers outside their doors for them, which i think is a bit stupid because the longer they live the longer they suffer and the longer the problem is unsolved. imo, female cats should be picked up and neutered so that procreation is minimized and the problem will at least decrease.. i may be perceived as being heartless, but if the population is controlled, at least their little kittens wont have to suffer.. This topic has been edited by a member of staff (Anime) because of a violation of the forum rules. Do not post on topics that have been inactive for more than 3 weeks. Please check your user inbox to see if you have been contacted regarding this incident, then review our rules. Per the reason above, this topic has been LOCKED. Please contact Anime if you have any questions regarding this action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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